National Service for PRs Men and Women. What is yours???

[HP_Lee]

Beside the proposal of PR men serving army, I would suggest PR women to serve the healthcare sector as well. We have shortage of healthcare labours in all hospitals. This will help to brigde the labour problems in this sector and at the sometime, this provide better bonding between locals and PR foreigners. What is your thought???

Edited May 17, 2012 by HP_Lee

[Royho1979]

Beside the proposal of PR men serving army, I would suggest PR women to serve the healthcare sector as well. We have shortage of healthcare labours in all hospitals. This will help to brigde the labour problems in this sector and at the sometime, this provide better bonding between locals and PR foreigners. What is your thought???

 

 

That will be great. People like Darryl will get a chance to action on his love for Singapore and give back tangibly.

[Darryn]

That will be great. People like Darryl will get a chance to action on his love for Singapore and give back tangibly.

Darryl who?

 

Suggesting NS for PR women when citizen women don't do?

 

And if wanna say that both sexes must do NS is not right to restrict women to healthcare.

 

If wanna PR men to serve in army - must give them same chance of advancement as sg men. Remember this from a nation that until recently actively discriminate against Malay in the military.

 

But idea not workable. How many people will take up PR if must serve min 2 years in military? Will be virtually zero.

 

Also how will u pay them? An early thirties specialist engineer will u pay him his market rate or NS rate? If pay market rate is it wise? If pay NS rate how is he to support the family and commitments he is likely to have by that stage of life?

 

Finally, if tell me that upon getting PRat age 28 I put life on hold while I serve NS I would have to serve NS I would have turned down

[Happily1986]

Darryl who?

 

Suggesting NS for PR women when citizen women don't do?

 

And if wanna say that both sexes must do NS is not right to restrict women to healthcare.

 

If wanna PR men to serve in army - must give them same chance of advancement as sg men. Remember this from a nation that until recently actively discriminate against Malay in the military.

 

But idea not workable. How many people will take up PR if must serve min 2 years in military? Will be virtually zero.

 

Also how will u pay them? An early thirties specialist engineer will u pay him his market rate or NS rate? If pay market rate is it wise? If pay NS rate how is he to support the family and commitments he is likely to have by that stage of life?

 

Finally, if tell me that upon getting PRat age 28 I put life on hold while I serve NS I would have to serve NS I would have turned down

 

Let me dispense you one valuable piece of advice. If you are unable to backup what you write with tangible evidence or empirical data, you could end up in a lot of trouble. you savvy?

[Darryn]

Let me dispense you one valuable piece of advice. If you are unable to backup what you write with tangible evidence or empirical data, you could end up in a lot of trouble. you savvy?

Is Gerald giam a credible enough source to believe and trust?

 

http://geraldgiam.sg/2009/06/malays-deserv...ies-in-the-saf/

 

If, as a mature citizen you need me to provide such proof, I have to wonder if u go through life with eyes open or closed.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Darryn

[Watwheels]

I voted no. Coz if local & PR cannot see eye to eye they might pick up the rifle & shoot each other. LOL...

Jokes aside. I think SAF dun want too many of their secrets leaking to other countries.

 

Anyway 2nd generation PR aka PR's sons have to do NS. No?

Women regardless PR or not they are playing supportive role in the family. Like taking care of elderly parent & or children when the man goes to serve NS. If husband & wife go serve NS where do the children go sia?

 

In sgp you will never get to see women go do NS otherwise there will be no birth rate. No time for family life.

So no offense but it's a dumb idea.

[Happily1986]

Is Gerald giam a credible enough source to believe and trust?

 

http://geraldgiam.sg/2009/06/malays-deserv...ies-in-the-saf/

 

If, as a mature citizen you need me to provide such proof, I have to wonder if u go through life with eyes open or closed.

 

so your claim rests upon the words of another person? *hohoho

 

I took a brief glance at Gerald's article.

 

There are still many

[Happily1986]

Is Gerald giam a credible enough source to believe and trust?

 

http://geraldgiam.sg/2009/06/malays-deserv...ies-in-the-saf/

 

If, as a mature citizen you need me to provide such proof, I have to wonder if u go through life with eyes open or closed.

 

And please. The honorific title possessed by the originator of a source or the perceived social standing of the individual shouldn't skew your judgement over the credibility of what he or she says. So what if an individual is a grandmaster emeritus honorary field marshal of the greatest order of the lordcrap Empire? you still damn well scrutinise what he or she say/write.

 

For the meaningful insult you dished out to me as boldened in your original reply above, it simply screams out "oh the irony of man!" especially when it comes from a man who thinks that the words can be trusted just because it is written by a NMP?

 

So?

[Darryn]

I grabbed on quick cite from a smart phone search. Was also aware of LKY quote.

 

There are explicit admissions all over the place that Malay have been barred from sensitive posts. What is that if not discrimination. And if you know anything at all you know I don't have to prove discrimination.

 

I only need to show an the honestly held belief of a reasonable person (I think this wording is close but havent reconfirmed.

 

Given all the sources out there, one of whom is LKY, how is the belief not reasonable.

 

Infact, given your own cite, I would throw the ball back to you to show there wasnt discrimination.

so your claim rests upon the words of another person? *hohoho

 

I took a brief glance at Gerald's article.

 

There are still many

[Ladykillerz]

Beside the proposal of PR men serving army, I would suggest PR women to serve the healthcare sector as well. We have shortage of healthcare labours in all hospitals. This will help to brigde the labour problems in this sector and at the sometime, this provide better bonding between locals and PR foreigners. What is your thought???

 

i think you got a good proposal here.

but that will deter majority to migrate here too.

[Happily1986]

I grabbed on quick cite from a smart phone search. Was also aware of LKY quote.

 

There are explicit admissions all over the place that Malay have been barred from sensitive posts. What is that if not discrimination. And if you know anything at all you know I don't have to prove discrimination.

 

Show me. This had better not be unsubstantiated or even worse, anecdotal evidence.

 

I only need to show an the honestly held belief of a reasonable person (I think this wording is close but havent reconfirmed.

 

Are you serious? Does the determination of whether there is or there isn't prejudice let alone discrimination hinge solely on the opinion of this one "reasonable person"?

 

Given all the sources out there, one of whom is LKY, how is the belief not reasonable.

 

You cited Gerald. I already proven to you as per my previous reply how Gerald's posting on his blog cannot be used to support your charge. His assertion and your allegation are soundly different. And no, i am not being pedantic.

 

Infact, given your own cite, I would throw the ball back to you to show there wasnt discrimination.

 

Oh please. In such a scenario like this if you are being hauled to court, the prosecution would definitely swoop double quick time to push the burden of proving there is discrimination onto YOU, the defendant. you think you can sit pretty and let the other side do all the work?

Edited May 17, 2012 by Happily1986

[Pain]

Darryl who?

 

Suggesting NS for PR women when citizen women don't do?

 

And if wanna say that both sexes must do NS is not right to restrict women to healthcare.

 

If wanna PR men to serve in army - must give them same chance of advancement as sg men. Remember this from a nation that until recently actively discriminate against Malay in the military.

 

But idea not workable. How many people will take up PR if must serve min 2 years in military? Will be virtually zero.

 

Also how will u pay them? An early thirties specialist engineer will u pay him his market rate or NS rate? If pay market rate is it wise? If pay NS rate how is he to support the family and commitments he is likely to have by that stage of life?

 

Finally, if tell me that upon getting PRat age 28 I put life on hold while I serve NS I would have to serve NS I would have turned down

 

This is so funny. Im a singaporean who served the army and even i don't get the same chance of advancement as my PR counterparts who didnt serve ns

 

PRs are really asking for more than Singaporeans these days

 

Or maybe singaporeans are just plain dafts to just do anything which is thrown at them? i don't know

[HP_Lee]

i think you got a good proposal here.

but that will deter majority to migrate here too.

The main idea to to deter PRs from taking the land as a step stone to their whatever agendas. The reasons of including PR women to takeup national service in healthcare, also re-enforce the commitment to the country. If you are already a citizen of Singapore, need not to serve. That's also the privilege of Singaporean.

[Piyopico]

[/size]

Darryl who?

 

Suggesting NS for PR women when citizen women don't do?

 

And if wanna say that both sexes must do NS is not right to restrict women to healthcare.

 

If wanna PR men to serve in army - must give them same chance of advancement as sg men. Remember this from a nation that until recently actively discriminate against Malay in the military.

 

But idea not workable. How many people will take up PR if must serve min 2 years in military? Will be virtually zero.

 

Also how will u pay them? An early thirties specialist engineer will u pay him his market rate or NS rate? If pay market rate is it wise? If pay NS rate how is he to support the family and commitments he is likely to have by that stage of life?

 

Finally, if tell me that upon getting PRat age 28 I put life on hold while I serve NS I would have to serve NS I would have turned down

 

I am perplexed by these two question/statements.

 

Advancement in what? You mean the two years stint during NS? No problem, by all means. The PRs can be sgt, Lta or whatever they are selected for.

 

How you pay the PR during NS? Of course NS pay. Is this a trick question? Serve NS still wanna peg to the top 6 PR salaries? If you wanna cite reservist then different case. Peg to the person's salary like all citizens.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Piyopico

[Darryn]

http://theonlinecitizen.com/2012/01/unfair...tional-service/

Another cite.

[HP_Lee]

I voted no. Coz if local & PR cannot see eye to eye they might pick up the rifle & shoot each other. LOL...

Jokes aside. I think SAF dun want too many of their secrets leaking to other countries.

 

Anyway 2nd generation PR aka PR's sons have to do NS. No?

Women regardless PR or not they are playing supportive role in the family. Like taking care of elderly parent & or children when the man goes to serve NS. If husband & wife go serve NS where do the children go sia?

 

In sgp you will never get to see women go do NS otherwise there will be no birth rate. No time for family life.

So no offense but it's a dumb idea.

bro. Serving National service are referring to person @ 18years old. I doubt anyone would have family commitments at this stage of life. In general PRs today are better off, than our forefathers came near to fight for a living many years back.

Edited May 17, 2012 by HP_Lee

[Royho1979]

Darryl who?

 

Suggesting NS for PR women when citizen women don't do?

 

And if wanna say that both sexes must do NS is not right to restrict women to healthcare.

 

If wanna PR men to serve in army - must give them same chance of advancement as sg men. Remember this from a nation that until recently actively discriminate against Malay in the military.

 

But idea not workable. How many people will take up PR if must serve min 2 years in military? Will be virtually zero.

 

Also how will u pay them? An early thirties specialist engineer will u pay him his market rate or NS rate? If pay market rate is it wise? If pay NS rate how is he to support the family and commitments he is likely to have by that stage of life?

 

Finally, if tell me that upon getting PRat age 28 I put life on hold while I serve NS I would have to serve NS I would have turned down

 

Darryl you lor

 

Wait a min... now male citizen do NS PR men dun do NS, you dun complain thats its not fair, but when PR female do NS and citizen do NS, you complain not fair? Something aint right with your sense of justice. Guess what, female citizens gave birth to male citizens. Wanna siam then convert to citizen early for female PR.

 

Aiyo ... why are you soooo transactional.. when it comes to the country asking back from you, and it hypothetical only, you become sooo defensive and have so many criteria and even threaten to turn down PR wor... what happened to the love you claim to have for the country?

 

At the end of the day, u will only take on PR if there is no NS liability right? and if you are not a PR you cant buy HDB ppty you wun even be in Singapore right? Still refuse to admit you are gaming the system? What happened to NZ is your motherland but you love Singapore a lot too... Wa.. need to reciprocate in actions then no more love?

 

BTW, all the issue about pay and compensation? Now it becomes a concern for you? guess what, Singaporean men have been living with it and suffering while people like you have your career advanced while having almost equal benefits. If the HDB ppty and other benefits that Singaporean men are entitled to aint too shabby for you, the allowance and the same ""

[Royho1979]

Show me. This had better not be unsubstantiated or even worse, anecdotal evidence.

 

I only need to show an the honestly held belief of a reasonable person (I think this wording is close but havent reconfirmed.

 

Are you serious? Does the determination of whether there is or there isn't prejudice let alone discrimination hinge solely on the opinion of this one "reasonable person"?

 

Given all the sources out there, one of whom is LKY, how is the belief not reasonable.

 

You cited Gerald. I already proven to you as per my previous reply how Gerald's posting on his blog cannot be used to support your charge. His assertion and your allegation are soundly different. And no, i am not being pedantic.

 

Infact, given your own cite, I would throw the ball back to you to show there wasnt discrimination.

 

Oh please. In such a scenario like this if you are being hauled to court, the prosecution would definitely swoop double quick time to push the burden of proving there is discrimination onto YOU, the defendant. you think you can sit pretty and let the other side do all the work?

 

 

Love the way you argue your case. Awesome...attack attack attack with solid facts and rational.