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59 replies to this topic | 257 praises

#1

Posted 28 November 2015 - 12:05 PM

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As many are considering to renew their ride for the next 10 years.

Was wondering, should we consider to place those important components of a car?
I know, the golden rule if it aren't spoiled, don't bother.

However, replacing them may helps to minimise the downtime and without a mode of transport.

I had a couple of bad incidents whereby the fuel pump went down as at 2nd day of cny. Carless and helpless for the next 5 days as most workshop are closed.

And recent, alternator went dead. Glad it was done in a couple of hours.

I read there isn't any hard rules on their lifespan.

Fuel pump can be prevented if tank is left half at most day to lubricate the pump.

Water pump is encourage to change upon the changing of belt.

What's your view on this?


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#2

Posted 28 November 2015 - 01:21 PM

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It's called preventive maintenance.
Yes, u can change them out earlier before they spoil.
But some items can show symptoms before they spoil, u need not change them if they don't.

#3

Posted 28 November 2015 - 04:55 PM

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My 0.02cts is if it a conti car, better to have to check and rectify prior to extension of COE.

 

If it's a BNB, you can take chances coz sushi or kimchi still can ' Tahan ' a bit as parts are easily available and most mechanic can handle BNB cars. [drivingcar]


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#4

Posted 28 November 2015 - 05:46 PM

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You know your own car and the ownership condtions best. If you have been doing regular maintenance, changing fluids and lubes at specified intervals, your car should be in good condition except for wear and tear parts after 10 years.

 

Once you have decided to renew COE, might as well do a major overhaul of worn parts or those likely to fail. As you have mentioned, they are : water pump, alternator, power steering pump, fuel pump. Other things to replace are engine mountings, shock absorbers & mountings, drive shafts and/or bellows, brake pads & disc. Air con compressor and evaporator too may need an overhaul especially if odours are present.

 

If your car has been subjected to mainly outdoor conditions, then the door seals may have to be changed too. Consider to give yourself a treat and have the car fully resprayed and theseat leather reconditioned. Your relatives will be impressed with the new looks and ride comfort

 

Do all these and you have given yourself a "new" car ready to be enjoyed again for at least next 5 years. At a fraction of the cost of a new car.



#5

Posted 28 November 2015 - 05:50 PM

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For fuel pump, it's very difficult to tell. Those who claim they can tell, i salute you. Also I don't think it matters if you leave half a tank of gas inside or pump when empty. The fuel pump will also happy happy just give up.

Water pump is easier. Most of the time it is the bearing that is worn causing leaks. Or the blades of the pump, but this is rare If you use coolant and not tap water. The blades won't really wear with coolant. Only the bearing.

Alternator you can somewhat tell. But there are also cases where it just dies with some minutes of warning. The battery hopefully should last you till you reach workshop. Listen for unusual noises when it spins or burnt smells.

It's part and parcel of driving. Sending a car for servicing doesn't mean that the fuel pump, alternator won't suddenly die the next day.
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#6

Posted 28 November 2015 - 08:19 PM

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For fuel pump, it's very difficult to tell. Those who claim they can tell, i salute you. Also I don't think it matters if you leave half a tank of gas inside or pump when empty. The fuel pump will also happy happy just give up.

Water pump is easier. Most of the time it is the bearing that is worn causing leaks. Or the blades of the pump, but this is rare If you use coolant and not tap water. The blades won't really wear with coolant. Only the bearing

Alternator you can somewhat tell. But there are also cases where it just dies with some minutes of warning. The battery hopefully should last you till you reach workshop. Listen for unusual noises when it spins or burnt smells.

It's part and parcel of driving. Sending a car for servicing doesn't mean that the fuel pump, alternator won't suddenly die the next day.

 

Your first paragraph about refueling at 1/2 or near empty making no difference to the lifespan of fuel pump is incorrect.

 

Quoting directly from the website, http://www.agcoauto....2_articleid/195

 

"When the fuel level is low, the pump has to work much harder to produce the same pressure. This is because the reduced fuel weight no longer pushes fuel into the pump. Instead the pump must draw the fuel in. A low fuel level also means less fuel to dissipate heat and lubricate the pump. The combination of an overworked pump, reduced cooling and lubrication will likely damage the fuel pump."

 

The fuel pump in my previous ride failed simply because I almost always refuel after the low fuel indicator lights up. Now, I have changed my habit of refueling at 1/4 or 1/2 mark.


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#7

Posted 28 November 2015 - 08:33 PM

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For fuel pump, it's very difficult to tell. Those who claim they can tell, i salute you. Also I don't think it matters if you leave half a tank of gas inside or pump when empty. The fuel pump will also happy happy just give up.

Water pump is easier. Most of the time it is the bearing that is worn causing leaks. Or the blades of the pump, but this is rare If you use coolant and not tap water. The blades won't really wear with coolant. Only the bearing.

Alternator you can somewhat tell. But there are also cases where it just dies with some minutes of warning. The battery hopefully should last you till you reach workshop. Listen for unusual noises when it spins or burnt smells.

It's part and parcel of driving. Sending a car for servicing doesn't mean that the fuel pump, alternator won't suddenly die the next day.

Fuel pump, engine mounting and alternator replacement, I had experience before hence can share.

Fuel pump, difficult to explain.. basically the engine won't start.

Alternator, usually many would thought it's the car battery. Hence would ask for help to jump start, despite doing slow.. you will notice the fading of the battery life or speedo indicator.. then it's the alternator.

Engine mounting, in short, engine will vibrate vigorously

Hope can understand my poor but best explanations.

So based on what you mentioned, don't seem to be a need to change. Only the bearing.

Edited by Kurty, 28 November 2015 - 08:37 PM.

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#8

Posted 28 November 2015 - 10:20 PM

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Your first paragraph about refueling at 1/2 or near empty making no difference to the lifespan of fuel pump is incorrect.

Quoting directly from the website, http://www.agcoauto....2_articleid/195

"When the fuel level is low, the pump has to work much harder to produce the same pressure. This is because the reduced fuel weight no longer pushes fuel into the pump. Instead the pump must draw the fuel in. A low fuel level also means less fuel to dissipate heat and lubricate the pump. The combination of an overworked pump, reduced cooling and lubrication will likely damage the fuel pump."

The fuel pump in my previous ride failed simply because I almost always refuel after the low fuel indicator lights up. Now, I have changed my habit of refueling at 1/4 or 1/2 mark.


Well i choose not to believe. Not everything written on the Internet is correct. R&d engineers cannot be that stupid to not account for an empty tank all the time. That's what most will do. Anyway there is a small baffle that the fule pump sits in. So it is still cooled. Fuel pump will fail whenever they want to. Doesn't mean that you always do not let it go below 1/2 tank it will last longer. To each his own.
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#9

Posted 28 November 2015 - 10:57 PM

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since renewing, i would do 

 

1. Suspension system (including engine mounts) - shocks, arms, link ends, bearings etc

2. cooling system - hoses, radiator, fans etc

3. all the belts. if timing belt about due, can also change together with water pump

 

 

 

the rest can wait till they break down. 


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#10

Posted 28 November 2015 - 11:42 PM

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Fuel pump, engine mounting and alternator replacement, I had experience before hence can share.

Fuel pump, difficult to explain.. basically the engine won't start.

Alternator, usually many would thought it's the car battery. Hence would ask for help to jump start, despite doing slow.. you will notice the fading of the battery life or speedo indicator.. then it's the alternator.

Engine mounting, in short, engine will vibrate vigorously

Hope can understand my poor but best explanations.

So based on what you mentioned, don't seem to be a need to change. Only the bearing.

 

most of the time, alternator or starter motor can be serviced or repaired without replacing the entire unit.

 

check the aircon magnetic clutch. if it is already worn and fails to engage the compressor, verify if it can be replaced without replacing the entire compressor.

 

parts like engine mounting, wheel bearings, serpentine belt etc should be replaced as and when symptoms like excessive vibrations, whining or creaking noises appear. 



#11

Posted 29 November 2015 - 01:07 AM

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Well i choose not to believe. Not everything written on the Internet is correct. R&d engineers cannot be that stupid to not account for an empty tank all the time. That's what most will do. Anyway there is a small baffle that the fule pump sits in. So it is still cooled. Fuel pump will fail whenever they want to. Doesn't mean that you always do not let it go below 1/2 tank it will last longer. To each his own.

 

I dismantle my fuel pump b4. Its warm to hot to touch. However for 1/4 tank. There is enough to cool the outer casing of the pump. 

I believe is the heat that destroy fuel pump. 



#12

Posted 29 November 2015 - 09:49 AM

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I dismantle my fuel pump b4. Its warm to hot to touch. However for 1/4 tank. There is enough to cool the outer casing of the pump.
I believe is the heat that destroy fuel pump.


I agree. I have been advised and also read before, it's a rule of thumb no-no to drive the car till the last drop of fuel. Fuel pump lifespan will reduce due to the heat. Fuel cools down the pump.

#13

Posted 29 November 2015 - 01:13 PM

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I agree. I have been advised and also read before, it's a rule of thumb no-no to drive the car till the last drop of fuel. Fuel pump lifespan will reduce due to the heat. Fuel cools down the pump.

 

For this, I also don't know the answer. But recently I have also switched to filling up when fuel indicator says 2 bars. Low fuel light appears at 1 bar.



#14

Posted 29 November 2015 - 01:20 PM

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Well, if you upkeep the car, then do the critical change and do read the car manual for the understanding.

 

My car has more or less done all these with only 6 months left......



#15

Posted 29 November 2015 - 01:31 PM

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Your first paragraph about refueling at 1/2 or near empty making no difference to the lifespan of fuel pump is incorrect.

Quoting directly from the website, http://www.agcoauto....2_articleid/195

"When the fuel level is low, the pump has to work much harder to produce the same pressure. This is because the reduced fuel weight no longer pushes fuel into the pump. Instead the pump must draw the fuel in. A low fuel level also means less fuel to dissipate heat and lubricate the pump. The combination of an overworked pump, reduced cooling and lubrication will likely damage the fuel pump."

The fuel pump in my previous ride failed simply because I almost always refuel after the low fuel indicator lights up. Now, I have changed my habit of refueling at 1/4 or 1/2 mark.


Of coz la, if most of the time refuel when fuel tank is very low or warning lights come on, it is very bad for fuel pump. Try to always pump petrol when fuel reaches 1/5 marks can already. As long as there is sufficient fuel and not too low, fuel pump will be good and can last more then 10 yrs.

#16

Posted 29 November 2015 - 01:43 PM

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Well i choose not to believe. Not everything written on the Internet is correct. R&d engineers cannot be that stupid to not account for an empty tank all the time. That's what most will do. Anyway there is a small baffle that the fule pump sits in. So it is still cooled. Fuel pump will fail whenever they want to. Doesn't mean that you always do not let it go below 1/2 tank it will last longer. To each his own.

That is why there is low fuel warning light comes on when fuel is super low. By right as a driver, we should not wait till fuel warning lights to turn on then start to look for petrol station. If we frequently wait till fuel lights come on and look for petrol station, it will really spoil the fuel pump at an accelerating rate. Fuel pump is able to last for a lifetime if it is well taken care of.

So for normal driving, I believe many people will not want to wait for fuel warning lights to come on then start looking for petrol station right? It is only for some drivers who always like to find out the extreme of what the car can do, or have the shiok feeling that yes I break my own record of reaching super low fuel and pump full tank, it can pump 50L where normally I can only pump 40L or somewhere along that line. These drivers are only testing out the limits on when the car will breakdown faster.

Edited by Yewheng, 29 November 2015 - 01:47 PM.


#17

Posted 29 November 2015 - 01:52 PM

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That is why there is low fuel warning light comes on when fuel is super low. By right as a driver, we should not wait till fuel warning lights to turn on then start to look for petrol station. If we frequently wait till fuel lights come on and look for petrol station, it will really spoil the fuel pump at an accelerating rate. Fuel pump is able to last for a lifetime if it is well taken care of.

So for normal driving, I believe many people will not want to wait for fuel warning lights to come on then start looking for petrol station right? It is only for some drivers who always like to find out the extreme of what the car can do, or have the shiok feeling that yes I break my own record of reaching super low fuel and pump full tank, it can pump 50L where normally I can only pump 40L or somewhere along that line. These drivers are only testing out the limits on when the car will breakdown faster.

Those who engineer and design things will have this taken care off. If the pump really really need ls to be covered with fuel to work well, they will design it to take care of the lowest fuel level. It's the same as using 40wt engine oil when the manual specifies 20wt. I really wonder why we all want to be Kay khiang and second guess everything.

Anyway as I said to each his own.

Edited by Mkl22, 29 November 2015 - 01:57 PM.


#18

Posted 29 November 2015 - 05:43 PM

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You know your own car and the ownership condtions best. If you have been doing regular maintenance, changing fluids and lubes at specified intervals, your car should be in good condition except for wear and tear parts after 10 years.

Once you have decided to renew COE, might as well do a major overhaul of worn parts or those likely to fail. As you have mentioned, they are : water pump, alternator, power steering pump, fuel pump. Other things to replace are engine mountings, shock absorbers & mountings, drive shafts and/or bellows, brake pads & disc. Air con compressor and evaporator too may need an overhaul especially if odours are present.

If your car has been subjected to mainly outdoor conditions, then the door seals may have to be changed too. Consider to give yourself a treat and have the car fully resprayed and theseat leather reconditioned. Your relatives will be impressed with the new looks and ride comfort

Do all these and you have given yourself a "new" car ready to be enjoyed again for at least next 5 years. At a fraction of the cost of a new car.


Good advice

#19

Posted 29 November 2015 - 05:49 PM

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Those who engineer and design things will have this taken care off. If the pump really really need ls to be covered with fuel to work well, they will design it to take care of the lowest fuel level. It's the same as using 40wt engine oil when the manual specifies 20wt. I really wonder why we all want to be Kay khiang and second guess everything.

Anyway as I said to each his own.


An in tank fuel pump is better kept submerged in fuel.
It is designed to be that way. And well perform best under those conditions.
The factory manual wont tell you that it will fail, it will just tell you to top up as soon as the light comes on.
No need to bleed your tank dry lah....heh heh

#20

Posted 29 November 2015 - 09:16 PM

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For Altis, I recall that it does say its good practice to refill no later than the 1/4 mark.
 

An article I read says that this 1/4 rule, is good, but especially applicable for DI engines.  Coz between MPI & DI, its the latter pump that deals with a lot more pressure.

But even for MPI its still good practice coz, the Altis manual says low levels may lead to misfiring.  My Ws says that if for some reason, say the petrol is swooshing around ......the pump coudnt suck up properly, will cause misfire.

 

Being OCD, I would like to add that many conti cars have easily 55-60 litre tanks.  So 1/4 means ~15L balance.  So in the case of small tanks....e.g.,  Honda Vez, Jz, City....with 40L tanks, best to keep it to min 1/3 tank.


 


Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.

Friedrich Nietzsche


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