Singapore 'disappointed' with 'irresponsible report'

[Mercury1]

China always likes playing breaking point politics,. you give them an inch and them will keeping pushing to take a mile until they know your break point. With Duterte onboard they also dun dare push too much cause he is a loose cannon, Obama is somewhat of a softie so they treat him as such. Touch wood if trump took over you will again see a different kind of respect from Prc govt.

 

Of course Singapore being small we have to play the game carefully, but side with China for me is a dead no, as the island is majority Chinese they will literally want us to rule in their favor for everything. If anything we should be on the side of Asean, unfortunately we not united enough but everyone shares the same concerns. Our PM should least of all get Asean together as a united front before trying to speak for their interest.

[Playtime]

In an April 2014 issue of Forbes magazine, LKY wrote about the South China Sea dispute between the China and its smaller neighbours including the Philippines.

 

âThe disputes, which arise from claims based on different principles, are unlikely to be resolvedâ.

 

Lee explained that China does not see itself becoming a global leader without control of virtually the entire South China Sea, where a third of the world's trade passes through.

 

âMuch more is at stake than rocks and resources. China sees the South China Sea as one of its key interests. A rising China is asserting its position by claiming historical rights to these watersâ.

 

Lee said Philippine-initiated arbitration through the United Nations tribunal, meanwhile, is a juridical platform that major global powers such as China and the United States do not submit to.

 

âA resurgent China isn't going to allow its sea boundaries to once again be decided by external partiesâ.

 

China is not happy with Singapore because they see the actions of LHL is tantamount to challenging its key interest. LHL has apparently failed to take note of what his late father had said.

Even back then when china was much weaker, and he had strong personal relations with Chinese leaders, LKY still knew his place and spoke softly, discreetly, respectfully even though it is arguable that the PRC sometimes sought LKY input.

That china Taiwan even chose singapore as a meeting place showed the depth of trust singapore was given. They even regularly sent people here to train.

See how far we have fallen? ? Was it arrogance? Or incompetence? Or all.

 

Make no mistake, today's china is different, even LKY may not get the same level of respect from their new leaders anymore.

And then we get the current bunch, talk so loud talk so much. ..

But timing, audience and content all wrong.

 

The next PM is in deep shit, he will pay the price. And the candidates aren't that impressive to start with.

 

I worry for singapore.

[Wishcumstrue]

Looking at how our current gov (miss) manage the situation over the SCS dispute, how I wish people like George Yeo to be around as a FM.

 

If we fail to manage this, we will be failing Singapore's own future as well loosing the status and respect so hard worn by LKY generation.

 

 

George Yeo - Countries should not underestimate legality of Beijing's South China Sea arguments

http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-asia/countries-should-not-underestimate-legality-of-beijings-south-china-sea-arguments

"China's claims are not weak… I can understand the force of feelings from Southeast Asian countries but it would be a serious mistake to underestimate the legality of China's claims and therefore underestimate their will,"

 

 

 

 

George Yeo shared his view on SCS dispute - 41:20min

 

Edited October 1, 2016 by Wishcumstrue

[Uncle2]

Singapore without LKY is a completely different Singapore to the rest of the world.

 

LKY and his team made Singapore what it is today. The current generation of leaders were mainly riding on LKY and team hard work. Please don't forget LKY and team were paid peanuts but we did not get monkeys or baboons. However, the new generation of leaders were paid millions and what we got...... already the ills of gambling by two casinos are not enough we now have online gambling approved.

 

My personal take is our new generation of leaders are so self assured because they seem to be invisible I'm Singapore. For them everything they wish or want get carried out in Singapore. They forget the International community despite envious of our development really don't give two hoots about us, let alone having us to tell them or teach them what to do. They don't owe us a living.

 

Singapore had always play a dangerous game by playing two sides of the coin. In the past it was OK because China was then considerably weaker but today in 2020 or 2025 China economy may surpass USA. The world dynamic changes.

 

The Philippines president is not a dumb 70 plus old man. What can USA do for Philippines that today China can do more for them then USA. Despite world arbitration decides on Philippines win on ownership of islands in south China sea, Philippines is sending their past president to China to negotiate.

 

The importance of Singapore as a strategic partner in military and economic terms can easily be replaced by any a Sean countries, perhaps not now but in the near future.

 

If you are a businessman who would you trade with a country with 6 to 7 million people or one with 200 million people. Indonesia for one is taking great pains to clean up their act.

 

Singapore's bank secrecy act and other policies are making a joke about money laundering despite we are the largest financial Centre in south east Asia. 1MDB had delivered a severe blow to out financial reputation.

 

In the world of politics and power, who has money and power commands the most.

 

eg in this forum, if our undertaker says the background colour of my car forum is black, just how many is brave enough to challenge undertaker to say it is off white?

If you ask me for an answer, my answer would be the background colour of MCF is black.

 

(When I answer that question I will put on my black sunglasses).

 

I guess this is how the real world works at times.

领导无方，吃力不讨好

[macrotrust2]

NO fear- If Singapore is the whipping boy for China anger over SCS-So be it- These Chinese Media thing always pick on the little dot- whenever they not happy with anything- Can we stop them from doing it- there is nothing we can do. why bother. They can say what they want- Do they dare to touch you? What can they do -sanction our GLC only what or send aircraft over- they must be joking. 

 

We cannot please everyone- it is best to stay neutral- all the world can see the bully at work. Bully is everywhere even in school, NS, Workplace or cyber space- so what-  so long u stay neutral and know our place or position in relation to all country we are safe.

 

People can judge us by our action- not word so why give so much damn about those media thing- Singapore interest come first- no matter what- regardless of what happen. 

 

Dont jump to conclusion too soon- or play the fear factor of China too much- dont frighten yourself- u r only presuming other action only- so long u stay neutral- we are safe. We just make sure it is a win win situation for everyone. We know when to pick a fight , or avoid a fight or fight another day n it is best not fight in the first place- that is smart strategy.

 

 

[Wishcumstrue]

NO fear- If Singapore is the whipping boy for China anger over SCS-So be it- These Chinese Media thing always pick on the little dot- whenever they not happy with anything- Can we stop them from doing it- there is nothing we can do. why bother. They can say what they want- Do they dare to touch you? What can they do -sanction our GLC only what or send aircraft over- they must be joking. 

 

We cannot please everyone- it is best to stay neutral- all the world can see the bully at work. Bully is everywhere even in school, NS, Workplace or cyber space- so what-  so long u stay neutral and know our place or position in relation to all country we are safe.

 

People can judge us by our action- not word so why give so much damn about those media thing- Singapore interest come first- no matter what- regardless of what happen. 

 

Dont jump to conclusion too soon- or play the fear factor of China too much- dont frighten yourself- u r only presuming other action only- so long u stay neutral- we are safe. We just make sure it is a win win situation for everyone. We know when to pick a fight , or avoid a fight or fight another day n it is best not fight in the first place- that is smart strategy.

 

It is precisely our actions that fails to match the words that lead others to see the hypocrisy in our current leadership.

 

No one is picking a fight unless we goes around offending others.

[Voodooman]

We better pray US stays engaged in Asia. Some interesting quotes for thoughts. We can't stop China from dominating Asia but don't think we want to eat Chinese shits forever.

 

Quote from LKY.

 

"America is a great nation not just because of its power and wealth, but mainly because it is a nation moved by high ideals. Only the elevating power of her idealism can explain the benign manner in which America has exercised its enormous power since the end of World War II and the magnanimity and generosity with which it has shared its wealth to rebuild a more prosperous world."

 

Imagine it is the Chinese or Indian... Americans are no saints but they are angels compared to the Chinese, should they become the only super power in the world.

 

Quote from Hồ Chí Minh

 

"You fools! Don't you realize what it means if the Chinese remain? Don't you remember your history? The last time the Chinese came, they stayed a thousand years. The French are foreigners. They are weak. Colonialism is dying. The white man is finished in Asia. But if the Chinese stay now, they will never go. As for me, I prefer to sniff French shit for five years than to eat Chinese shit for the rest of my life."

[Pegus]

It is precisely our actions that fails to match the words that lead others to see the hypocrisy in our current leadership.

 

No one is picking a fight unless we goes around offending others.

 

Boy! You really sound like a chicken.

[Mercury1]

Reminds me that every time I visit my grandparents village the village head (who's predecessor had a bicycle while he himself moved on to a a 5 series) never fails to keep asking us for more donations for the village. Its like our family will forever be indentured to the village or maybe he just wants a 7 series 

 

And yes while the mainlainders continue to criticize the overseas Chinese for not being respectful enough they also conveniently forgot who donated money to build their school's and businesses and what not during their times of need.

 

 

We better pray US stays engaged in Asia. Some interesting quotes for thoughts. We can't stop China from dominating Asia but don't think we want to eat Chinese shits forever.

Quote from LKY.

"America is a great nation not just because of its power and wealth, but mainly because it is a nation moved by high ideals. Only the elevating power of her idealism can explain the benign manner in which America has exercised its enormous power since the end of World War II and the magnanimity and generosity with which it has shared its wealth to rebuild a more prosperous world."

Imagine it is the Chinese or Indian... Americans are no saints but they are angels compared to the Chinese, should they become the only super power in the world.

Quote from Hồ Chí Minh

"You fools! Don't you realize what it means if the Chinese remain? Don't you remember your history? The last time the Chinese came, they stayed a thousand years. The French are foreigners. They are weak. Colonialism is dying. The white man is finished in Asia. But if the Chinese stay now, they will never go. As for me, I prefer to sniff French shit for five years than to eat Chinese shit for the rest of my life."

 

[Wishcumstrue]

We better pray US stays engaged in Asia. Some interesting quotes for thoughts. We can't stop China from dominating Asia but don't think we want to eat Chinese shits forever.

 

Quote from LKY.

 

"America is a great nation not just because of its power and wealth, but mainly because it is a nation moved by high ideals. Only the elevating power of her idealism can explain the benign manner in which America has exercised its enormous power since the end of World War II and the magnanimity and generosity with which it has shared its wealth to rebuild a more prosperous world."

 

Imagine it is the Chinese or Indian... Americans are no saints but they are angels compared to the Chinese, should they become the only super power in the world.

 

Quote from Hồ Chí Minh

 

"You fools! Don't you realize what it means if the Chinese remain? Don't you remember your history? The last time the Chinese came, they stayed a thousand years. The French are foreigners. They are weak. Colonialism is dying. The white man is finished in Asia. But if the Chinese stay now, they will never go. As for me, I prefer to sniff French shit for five years than to eat Chinese shit for the rest of my life."

 

There is a caveat in that quote from that Grand Master book.

You have to read the entire Chp 2 to appreciate the context.

 

http://www.theatlantic.com/china/archive/2013/03/interview-lee-kuan-yew-on-the-future-of-us-china-relations/273657/

The United States cannot stop China's rise. It just has to live with a bigger China, which will be completely novel for the United States, as no country has ever been big enough to challenge its position. China will be able to do so in 20 or 30 years. Americans have to eventually share their preeminent position with China.

 

This is the exactly the same idea which Xi had proposed to Obama during their 2012 Summit under the catchphrase

新型大国关系.   Unfortunately,  it became clear to the Chinese that US has no interest in sharing power nor wanting to see with Asian people as equal after Obama didn't even bother to response to this idea, let alone even mention the term. This is where the danger lies and hence the seed of growing mistrust across the Pacific since Obama's 2nd term.

 

Chinese Enthusiasm and American Cynicism Over the “New Type of Great Power Relations

Traditionally, American policy makers have no interest in embracing a new geopolitical framework offered by another country. There are unspoken concerns that American recognition of the Chinese concept would not only imply that Obama is taking a backseat role in the bilateral relationship, but also suggest that the United States recognizes itself as the declining established power in a “Thucydides trap” with rising China.

 

 

BTW, the so-called quote from the Vietnamese Communist leader has never been proven.

So, please verify your source: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Ho_Chi_Minh

Edited October 1, 2016 by Wishcumstrue

[Wishcumstrue]

Boy! You really sound like a chicken.

 

I can sound like anything if you can't understand the discussion

[Voodooman]

There is a caveat in that quote from that Grand Master book.

You have to read the entire Chp 2 to appreciate the context.

 

http://www.theatlantic.com/china/archive/2013/03/interview-lee-kuan-yew-on-the-future-of-us-china-relations/273657/

The United States cannot stop China's rise. It just has to live with a bigger China, which will be completely novel for the United States, as no country has ever been big enough to challenge its position. China will be able to do so in 20 or 30 years. Americans have to eventually share their preeminent position with China.

 

This is the exactly the same idea which Xi had proposed to Obama during their 2012 Summit under the catchphrase

æ°å大å½å³ç³». Unfortunately, it became clear to the Chinese that US has no interest in sharing power nor wanting to see with Asian people as equal after Obama didn't even bother to response to this idea, let alone even mention the term. This is where the danger lies and hence the seed of growing mistrust across the Pacific since Obama's 2nd term.

 

Chinese Enthusiasm and American Cynicism Over the âNew Type of Great Power Relations

Traditionally, American policy makers have no interest in embracing a new geopolitical framework offered by another country. There are unspoken concerns that American recognition of the Chinese concept would not only imply that Obama is taking a backseat role in the bilateral relationship, but also suggest that the United States recognizes itself as the declining established power in a âThucydides trapâ with rising China.

 

 

BTW, the so-called quote from the Vietnamese Communist leader has never been proven.

So, please verify your source: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Ho_Chi_Minh

Well, what China is doing now to its neighbors certainly smells like a lot of Chinese shits. Lol.

[Wishcumstrue]

Well, what China is doing now to its neighbors certainly smells like a lot of Chinese shits. Lol.

 

Well, everyone has their own shit to clear.

 

Trouble only comes when an outside Sh!t-stirrer comes along trying to create problem that has been pretty well managed over last 30 years.

[macrotrust2]

It is precisely our actions that fails to match the words that lead others to see the hypocrisy in our current leadership.

 

No one is picking a fight unless we goes around offending others.

In any diplomacy or strategic move- rule 101 states that there is always a trade off with any policy that u take- this cannot be avoided. Either damn or be damned- either way  cannot please everyone.

 

Therefore everything is a calculated move-with all scenario play and anticipation of each other action and reaction. What can you do- Stand still, move left or right- also kenna whack - might as well align your interest to those with shared value or principle- 

 

Offending other- is relative in time and space- there is no permanent friend or enemy only common interest.  This is a fact of life- if LKY is around- i am sure he would do the same- A peaceful rising China only came about within the last 30 yrs- Where is China in those days- still developing- 

 

Now "developed"- still learning the craft of international relationship- given its "closed door" policy which they were isolated referring to their historical path. The important thing is live and let live- just because you are now better position- u dont shit around with your neighbours & pull your weight on others.

 

To put it in context- these are so called "noise" created by intellectual- who got nothing to do- to create a theme for their existence- If i were u it is only a mental exercise or intellectual exchange - we still live and exist with one another. Peaceful rising- means live and let live right? 

[Pinobii]

China should make Singapore pay over South China Sea dispute, says PLA adviser

 

 

 

 

Soldiers of China's People's Liberation Army (PLA) Navy patrol near a sign in the Spratly Islands.PHOTO: REUTERS

 

 

Published1 hour ago

 

Updated4 min ago

 

 

 

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Permalink:http://str.sg/4NErCopy

 

 

 

 

HONG KONG - Beijing should impose sanctions and retaliate against Singapore to make the Republic “pay the price for seriously damaging China’s interests”, an influential Chinese defence adviser reportedly told state radio.

The remarks by Professor Jin Yinan, director of the strategic research institute at the PLA’s National Defence University, is the latest salvo from China in a recent war of words over the South China Sea territorial spat.

The row erupted after the Global Times, a Chinese newspaper known for its often nationalistic reporting, claimed that Singapore insisted on adding contents that endorsed the Philippines’ South China Sea arbitration case against China in the final document of the Summit of the Non-Aligned Movement (NAM) in Venezuela last month.

 

 

 

 

 

<a target="_blank" href="#"><img src="https://s0.2mdn.net/4010624/1-UOB_PIB_BillsBuster_IMU_300x250_GIF.gif" width="300" height="250" border="0" /></a><img width="0px" height="0px" style="visibility:hidden" border="0" src="" />

The report prompted Singapore's Ambassador to China Stanley Loh to issue a written rebuttal, saying Singapore did not raise the South China Sea or the tribunal ruling in Manila's favour at the NAM Summit. The proposal to update the South-east Asia paragraphs in the NAM document, said Mr Loh, was the consensus position of all 10 Asean members.

But Jin, in an interview with state-owned China National Radio on Thursday, accused Singapore of taking an active role in turning the South China Sea dispute into an international issue in recent years, South China Morning Post reported on Saturday (Oct 1).

 

 

 

 

Singapore, Jin said, had advised Washington on the matter and stirred up conflicts between the US and China.

“It’s inevitable for China to strike back at Singapore, and not just on the public opinion front,” Jin was quoted as saying according to SCMP.

“Since Singapore has gone thus far, we have got to do something, be it retaliation or sanction. We must express our discontent.”

Jin confirmed to SCMP he had talked to CNR on Thursday and criticised Singapore, but he refused to detail what measures China might take to punish the country.Lee Kuan Yew had 'lost Beijing's respect'

Jin has been part of China’s delegation to the annual Shangri-La Dialogue, a regional security forum in Singapore, for the past two years.

In his interview with CNR, Jin said Singapore Prime Minster Lee Hsien Loong devoted his entire one-hour speech at last year’s Shangri-La Dialogue to the matter.

“What’s the full name of the Shangri-La Dialogue? Is it the Asia Security Summit? There are so many topics about Asian security, including unbalanced development, pollution, environment, climate, terrorism, racial problems ... But all the problems were ignored and the focus was just on China’s South China Sea disputes,” Jin was quoted as saying in the SCMP report.

“Who set up such a main topic?"

Jin said the Singapore government, which jointly organised the forum with British think tank the International Institute for Strategic Studies, had played the key role in sending the disputes to the top of the agenda.

The PLA major general also criticised late Singaporean prime minister Lee Kuan Yew, saying that it was on his advice to US President Barack Obama that caused Washington to turn its “pivot to Asia” into “the rebalance towards the Asia-Pacific”.

Mr Lee Kuan Yew had lost Beijing’s respect, said Jin.

“We understand [singapore] has to survive among big countries,” he said. “But now Singapore is not seeking balance among big countries – it is playing big countries off against each other ... this is playing with fire.”

Jin questioned whether Singapore was remaining neutral between China and the United States. He also highlighted the strategic value of Singapore’s Changi Naval Base to the US military, which stations littoral combat ships at the base.

But Jin said by opening the base to the Americans, Singapore was helping the US to establish a presence in an area crucial to China’s oil ­imports.

“Singapore claims it is a non-aligned country and its Changi Naval Base is an open port. But why don’t you invite the Chinese navy to berth at it?”Spat 'reveals Singapore's true stance'

Meanwhile the Global Times has published another article critical of Singapore.

In a commentary run on Friday, the paper said the war of words over the NAM summit document "has revealed the true face of Singapore to the Chinese public".

While China feels affinity towards Singapore because of the countries' shared ethnic heritage and admiration for the Republic's success, Singapore doesn't feel such brotherly affection for China, the article said.

Instead, it added, "Singaporeans have fully embraced the Western world, sharing similar values and looking at global affairs from a Western perspective. They find more common ground with the US than with China over regional matters".

It called for China to abandon any "impractical illusions towards the city-state in terms of political affairs".

"It must be treated as an ordinary player in international politics and a close military partner of the US in the Asia-Pacific, which China can work with for mutual benefits, and can also be tough with when it crosses the line."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

should we all start wearing this and stand in line? you wont see me there

 

The_Qing_Dynasty_Cixi_Imperial_Dowager_Empress_of_China_On_Throne_Sedan_With_Palace_Enuches.png

 

[Bismarck]

China always likes playing breaking point politics,. you give them an inch and them will keeping pushing to take a mile until they know your break point. With Duterte onboard they also dun dare push too much cause he is a loose cannon, Obama is somewhat of a softie so they treat him as such. Touch wood if trump took over you will again see a different kind of respect from Prc govt.

 

Of course Singapore being small we have to play the game carefully, but side with China for me is a dead no, as the island is majority Chinese they will literally want us to rule in their favor for everything. If anything we should be on the side of Asean, unfortunately we not united enough but everyone shares the same concerns. Our PM should least of all get Asean together as a united front before trying to speak for their interest.

 

Bro your reply is the best for me. No need to talk so much. Just take this 2 points for Singapore good enough liao.

[Mustank]

I think I better stock up on the taobao stuff :(

[Uncle2]

I think I better stock up on the taobao stuff :(

You better do it, think we are playing hard ball liao!

 

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/singapore-pm-lee-hsien-loong-053016886.html