Honda CRV -facelift with 1.5 turbo

[mengchain]

More on the Recall

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-autos-honda/japans-honda-to-recall-350000-cars-in-china-over-engine-issue-idUSKBN1FW124

 

The recall involves the CR-V sport utility vehicle and the Civic car equipped with a 1.5-litre turbo engine, Honda’s joint venture with Dongfeng Motor Group Co Ltd (0489.HK) said in a statement on Monday.

 

The company is calling back those cars to resolve a problem caused by an unusual amount of un-combusted petrol collecting in the engine’s lubricant oil pan.

 

The issue in some cases caused a strong odor of gasoline inside the car and in other cases the car’s check-engine light came on. Honda and Dongfeng plan to resolve the issue by updating the engine’s gasoline injection control software.

 

Honda officials said there had been no reports of accidents. They said the engine oil issue doesn’t affect the engine or the car’s performance.

 

The measure comes after CR-V and Civic owners turned to the Weibo microblog - China’s Twitter equivalent - and other means to air their complaints since mid January.

 

The recall points to an emerging pattern in China where customer complaints spiral out of control as they are aired out on Weibo, forcing an automaker to respond.

 

Years ago the kind of recall Honda announced on Monday could have been dealt through a so-called customer service action, industry officials and experts say. That refers to what the auto industry calls a “quiet recall”, which is less damaging financially and image-wise, where an automaker fixes a non-safety issue, often free of charge, whenever the customer comes to the dealership.

 

 

“Without Weibo, it would have gone on for years,” said James Chao, chief automotive analyst for IHS Markit in the Asia-Pacific region. “That’s the way it was for the industry in the pre-Weibo, pre-Twitter era.”

 

Honda did not say the scale of the move in its statement, but a Beijing-based spokesman and other company officials said Honda and its joint venture partner are likely to call back roughly 350,000 vehicles. “We’re still trying to determine the precise number of cars affected,” the spokesman said.

 

Normally un-combusted petrol ends up accumulated in the lubricant oil pan but evaporates under heat from the engine. Such evaporated petrol is by design put back into the engine combustion chamber as fuel.

 

The issue involving the CR-V and the Civic has occurred in northern China where temperatures can dip well below the freezing point and when drivers of the affected vehicles drive short distances frequently.

 

On short runs, Honda engineers believe the engine doesn’t warm up enough to help un-combusted petrol accumulated in the lubricant oil pan to evaporate.

[therock]

The power of the internet .. even in china

[mengchain]

The power of the internet .. even in china

Edited February 14, 2018 by mengchain

[MQX87511]

More on the Recall

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-autos-honda/japans-honda-to-recall-350000-cars-in-china-over-engine-issue-idUSKBN1FW124

 

The recall involves the CR-V sport utility vehicle and the Civic car equipped with a 1.5-litre turbo engine, Honda’s joint venture with Dongfeng Motor Group Co Ltd (0489.HK) said in a statement on Monday.

 

The company is calling back those cars to resolve a problem caused by an unusual amount of un-combusted petrol collecting in the engine’s lubricant oil pan.

 

The issue in some cases caused a strong odor of gasoline inside the car and in other cases the car’s check-engine light came on. Honda and Dongfeng plan to resolve the issue by updating the engine’s gasoline injection control software.

 

Honda officials said there had been no reports of accidents. They said the engine oil issue doesn’t affect the engine or the car’s performance.

 

The measure comes after CR-V and Civic owners turned to the Weibo microblog - China’s Twitter equivalent - and other means to air their complaints since mid January.

 

The recall points to an emerging pattern in China where customer complaints spiral out of control as they are aired out on Weibo, forcing an automaker to respond.

 

Years ago the kind of recall Honda announced on Monday could have been dealt through a so-called customer service action, industry officials and experts say. That refers to what the auto industry calls a “quiet recall”, which is less damaging financially and image-wise, where an automaker fixes a non-safety issue, often free of charge, whenever the customer comes to the dealership.

 

 

“Without Weibo, it would have gone on for years,” said James Chao, chief automotive analyst for IHS Markit in the Asia-Pacific region. “That’s the way it was for the industry in the pre-Weibo, pre-Twitter era.”

 

Honda did not say the scale of the move in its statement, but a Beijing-based spokesman and other company officials said Honda and its joint venture partner are likely to call back roughly 350,000 vehicles. “We’re still trying to determine the precise number of cars affected,” the spokesman said.

 

Normally un-combusted petrol ends up accumulated in the lubricant oil pan but evaporates under heat from the engine. Such evaporated petrol is by design put back into the engine combustion chamber as fuel.

 

The issue involving the CR-V and the Civic has occurred in northern China where temperatures can dip well below the freezing point and when drivers of the affected vehicles drive short distances frequently.

 

On short runs, Honda engineers believe the engine doesn’t warm up enough to help un-combusted petrol accumulated in the lubricant oil pan to evaporate.

China consumers request to refund money, as petrol diluted engine oil to increase oil level, Dongfeng-Honda said there is no solution unless redesign the fuel injection angle, which means engine body design wrongly, it is worldwide problem

[MQX87511]

http://finance.sina.com.cn/roll/2018-02-09/doc-ifyrkzqr0329665.shtml

[mengchain]

Just wondering if anyone notice the increase in the level of engine Oil for the 1.5T in Singapore.

 

Some people speculate that the issues in China are attribute to 

1) The extreme cold weather(Sub-Zero)

- The engine oil /block did not get hot enough to "reuse" the petrol in the engine oil. So it should no happen in Singapore given SG hot weather.

- On top of that there are water condensation that contribute to the oil dilution.

 

2) The Low octane Petrol use..

- Low Octane petrol will cause the ECU to "spray" more oil to prevent knocking (not sure how true maybe some expert can comment)

- China  petrol generally sub 90 (heard it is 86 to 88) whereas SG are 92/95/98 thus the amount of petrol per RPM is lesser. thus less petrol in engine Oil.

 

 

With the above factors (esp 1) not applicable in Singapore, the issuse should not happen..

Edited March 28, 2018 by mengchain

[Lala81]

same engine already being used since mid 2017 in USA civics. only china have problem?

Edited March 28, 2018 by Lala81

[Watwheels]

Just wondering if anyone notice the increase in the level of engine Oil for the 1.5T in Singapore.

 

Some people speculate that the issues in China are attribute to 

1) The extreme cold weather(Sub-Zero)

- The engine oil /block did not get hot enough to "reuse" the petrol in the engine oil. So it should no happen in Singapore given SG hot weather.

- On top of that there are water condensation that contribute to the oil dilution.

 

2) The Low octane Petrol use..

- Low Octane petrol will cause the ECU to "spray" more oil to prevent knocking (not sure how true maybe some expert can comment)

- China  petrol generally sub 90 (heard it is 86 to 88) whereas SG are 92/95/98 thus the amount of petrol per RPM is lesser. thus less petrol in engine Oil.

 

 

With the above factors (esp 1) not applicable in Singapore, the issuse should not happen..

 

1) The turbocharger uses the engine oil for lubrication. Common among TC engines. Depending on how the TC is being cooled, by coolant or by other means. The turbo run at high temperatures hence lubrication or oil being destroyed when the engine is under heavy load...it makes sense. Hence cooling is important so that the turbo burn less engine oil.

 

2) Ignition timing and engine compression ratio will determine the grade of petrol used. The turbo fan is powered by the flow of exhaust gas from the engine....not run on petrol. The higher the RON figure is to prevent engine knock. Spray what oil? This is not mazda's rotary engine. LoL... No lah. Where you get your hearsay from? The ecu will control the ignition timing to prevent engine knocking.

 

 

As for the petrol vapours entering the cabin it has to do with the fuel lines used. The hose's material is not suitable.

 

Edited March 28, 2018 by Watwheels

[mengchain]

1) The turbocharger uses the engine oil for lubrication. Common among TC engines. Depending on how the TC is being cooled, by coolant or by other means. The turbo run at high temperatures hence lubrication or oil being destroyed when the engine is under heavy load...it makes sense. Hence cooling is important so that the turbo burn less engine oil.

 

2) Ignition timing and engine compression ratio will determine the grade of petrol used. The turbo fan is powered by the flow of exhaust gas from the engine....not run on petrol. The higher the RON figure is to prevent engine knock. Spray what oil? This is not mazda's rotary engine. LoL... No lah. Where you get your hearsay from? The ecu will control the ignition timing to prevent engine knocking.

 

 

As for the petrol vapours entering the cabin it has to do with the fuel lines used. The hose's material is not suitable.

Haha I read ii from the CRV owner forums... I am no expert. I only hope that I did not make the wrong decision,. 

[Watwheels]

Haha I read ii from the CRV owner forums... I am no expert. I only hope that I did not make the wrong decision,. 

 

I see. Even when I read the article I find the explaination weird. The engine is a sealed unit. Petrol vapours if any will be recycled back to the engine via the PCV return hose and into the air intake manifold. The unburnt petrol can only exit at the exhaust. No way it will enter the cabin. If the petrol vapours enters the cabin means exhaust gases also enter with it together. It makes no sense. The only way petrol vapours can enter the cabin is when the fuel lines or valve is leaking.

[mengchain]

I see. Even when I read the article I find the explaination weird. The engine is a sealed unit. Petrol vapours if any will be recycled back to the engine via the PCV return hose and into the air intake manifold. The unburnt petrol can only exit at the exhaust. No way it will enter the cabin. If the petrol vapours enters the cabin means exhaust gases also enter with it together. It makes no sense. The only way petrol vapours can enter the cabin is when the fuel lines or valve is leaking.

But from Official Honda comment is that the engine is design for the petrol vapour to be reuse from the engine oil pit. (provided the engine oil got hot enough)

 

http://www.sangbe.com/article/285915.html

 

Too deep for me to understand.,.

Edited March 28, 2018 by mengchain

[andrewyewkc]

But from Official Honda comment is that the engine is design for the petrol vapour to be reuse from the engine oil pit. (provided the engine oil got hot enough)

 

http://www.sangbe.com/article/285915.html

 

Too deep for me to understand.,.

This is difficult for me to understand as well. Would it be possible for the petrol to detonate under the pistons?

[Contipro]

 

Anyway it seem only happened at northern of china weather.

Hence we are fortunate being at hot climate here..

Should be no issue and I think unlikely any recall will carried out here unless it related to safety aspect.

[mengchain]

Good summary of the problem and looks like Honda of Canada has issued an alert to dealers concerning the problem. 

 

http://www.hondaproblems.com/trends/crv-oil-dilution/

 

Also what seem to be another problem of the CRV that might be attributed to the 1.5T Engine.

 

http://www.hondaproblems.com/trends/crv-gas-smells/

 

 

Also seem that a  law firm of Sauder Schelkopf LLC is investigating a class action lawsuit on behalf of owners of Honda CR-V vehicles (model years 2016, 2017 and 2018) that are prone to engine oil contamination.

 

https://www.carcomplaints.com/alerts/ss-honda-crv-engine-oil-contamination.shtml

[mengchain]

More details:

https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Companies/Suspension-of-CR-V-sales-hits-Honda-in-China

 

 

Honda has indicated that testing in the cold environment of minus 20 C to minus 30 C was inadequate for the model. When the vehicle is driven repeatedly for short periods like five minutes in such an environment, fuel smells could seep into the cabin, the company concedes.

 

Sort of confirm that it should not happen to our 1.5T in Singapore...

[Watwheels]

It could be the "blow-by" Honda is talking about. Some fuel will escape thru the piston ring during the power stroke and into the PCV hose. If their PCV return hose is routed to the oil pan that should explain what Honda is saying. But how the petrol smell can get to the cabin is a mystery.

[mengchain]

As promised..

I given up looking for a tampered glass for the Infotainment Unit of the 2017 CRV..

Instead i got a tempered glass that fit a 10th Gen Civic Infotainment Unit to put it on the 2017 CRV Infotainment Unit.

It does cover most if not all of the "commonly used area"... Sure it can be slightly bigger.. But its better then nothing...

 

On the other NOTE : Update on the Honda CRV 1.5T in China..

 

https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Companies/Honda-to-resume-sales-of-China-flagship-CR-V

 

 

CHONGQING -- Honda Motor will resume sales of its CR-V sport utility vehicle in China after local authorities approved a revised recall plan.

Recalls will begin May 22 as the automaker prepares to restart sales of the flagship CR-Vs. About 130,000 units produced by Chinese venture Dongfeng Honda Automobile between February 2017 and February 2018 are subject to the recall. The vehicles had been flagged for concerns over engine issues that could be triggered by a combination of factors including low temperatures.

Honda was forced to suspend CR-V sales after Chinese authorities rejected its initial recall plan in February.

China's quality-control watchdog, which announced the decision Wednesday, likely gave the green light after Honda managed to prove that the replaced parts and upgraded engine control unit software could withstand various temperature conditions. The Japanese automaker is also likely to recall other cars equipped with the same engine as the CR-V.

The company's Chinese sales are largely fueled by the CR-V and its Accord sedan. Honda has struggled as a result of suspended CR-V sales, with new-car sales in China falling below year-earlier figures for the third straight month in April.

Considering the potential hit to the automaker's brand image, whether sales bounce back will be closely watched. Honda's recall issue has garnered attention online.

"We hope to continue to supply products and services that are reliable for our customers," Dongfeng Honda Automobile said in a statement released Wednesday.

 

 

Edited May 19, 2018 by mengchain

[DACH]

As promised..

I given up looking for a tampered glass for the Infotainment Unit of the 2017 CRV..

Instead i got a tempered glass that fit a 10th Gen Civic Infotainment Unit to put it on the 2017 CRV Infotainment Unit.

It does cover most if not all of the "commonly used area"... Sure it can be slightly bigger.. But its better then nothing...

 

Where did you get the tempered glass for the 10th gen Civic HU?