ST Forum: Military service opened doors for him

[Vulcann]

Mr Tan did not say what was his vocation nor which service he was in.

 

Anywaz good for him that he finds his experience opening doors for him overseas.

 

The rest of us or at least me seriously do not find our society truly appreciating our 2 or 2.5 years' sacrifice and subsequently reservist obligations

 

Guess some 80-dollar vouchers is some kind of recognisation I reckon....

 

From ST Forum:

 

http://www.straitstimes.com/premium/forum-...rs-him-20130321

 

Military service opened doors for him

Published on Mar 21, 2013

 

"TELL me about your military experience."

 

I have been asked this question repeatedly at interviews for schools and work throughout the world. And I have learnt that the very best global institutions value my military skills, discipline and teamwork.

 

I started out poorly. After faring badly in junior college and being rejected by local universities, I enlisted for national service and, after my basic military training, decided to sign on with the Singapore Armed Forces (SAF). I hoped to use my military service to bolster my applications for overseas universities.

 

The skills and experience that I gained in the SAF helped me break through seemingly impossible odds.

 

I was offered a place in a foreign university, got my degree, returned to the SAF, and left after serving my four-year bond.

 

I subsequently applied for and was accepted to a top United States graduate programme, then worked in non-governmental organisations (NGOs), international organisations and financial institutions.

 

I have been in no way disadvantaged or "behind my peers".

 

I am a valued contributor in these organisations because the very same leadership skills, teamwork, perseverance and discipline that I acquired in the SAF are equally applicable in NGO work, international diplomacy and development, and investment banking.

 

What is worth noting, however, is that, in my experience, local institutions value these skills and experience less. Where global institutions saw these as strengths, local ones generally did not. This must change.

 

Ultimately, regardless of the value we may or may not extract from national service, it helps to pause and reflect on the privilege of serving in the defence of one's loved ones and country.

 

And we should, perhaps, remember that young men (and women) considered it a privilege, duty and necessity to serve at the advent and formation of the earliest nation states and civilisations.

 

Tan Sheng Hui

[Vulcann]

Seriously do this guy think it will make any difference?

 

At end of the day I fear it will be another fruitless exercise to make someone look good [shakehead]

 

Our viewpoints matter?

 

Come on.

 

From ST Forum:

 

Engage NSmen in dialogue

Published on Mar 21, 2013

 

THE Ministry of Defence's establishment of the Committee to Strengthen National Service should be applauded ("When doing NS is its own reward"; last Friday).

 

Because this review committee is in a prime position to make recommendations, I believe a few strategies will enhance the value of the feedback gathered.

 

First, full-time and operationally ready national servicemen should be invited to share their experiences, as well as articulate unit-specific suggestions.

 

More importantly, beyond the engagement of regular soldiers or NS commanders, the enlistment of views from the ground would yield equally - if not more - constructive perspectives on how operations are actually executed.

 

One of the reasons why servicemen are apprehensive about participating in such conversations is that they are worried they might contravene directives when acting within the public sphere.

 

Representative focus group discussions, like the ones organised as part of Our Singapore Conversation, would be a good starting point.

 

Seemingly trivial frustrations over matters like excessive or needless regimentation and user-unfriendly online services might appear inconsequential. Nonetheless, a lack of attention can amplify negative perceptions or attitudes towards NS.

 

Second, the format of these discourses should be open and spontaneous, with no intimidation.

 

In the initial stage, participants should be free to raise any points they feel are pertinent.

 

Simultaneously, cross-vocation interactions can be encouraged, so that soldiers can get a better idea of the roles and responsibilities of their counterparts.

 

Subsequently, the servicemen can explore individual themes: welfare and benefits, management of servicemen, leadership opportunities, and the length and value of service.

 

Third, and most crucially, the ministry should not go into these sessions demanding answers, because the emphasis should be on the collaborative process.

 

As recent commentaries have reflected, questions such as "what recognition do soldiers deserve" and "should we place a price tag on NS" do not have straightforward answers.

 

The process might be messy, but it will be meaningful when participants gain an appreciation for diverse viewpoints.

 

It is a way of telling our servicemen - past and present - that their viewpoints matter, and that they matter.

 

Kwan Jin Yao

[Little_prince]

To be honest. Ns isnt a waste of time for mysf. I really learnt and grew up alot during that period. Moving out of one's comfort zone is a very enlightening experience.

[Hamburger]

ROD loh........ where got time

 

[Watwheels]

I guess it works in different ways for individuals with different mentality. There are those who will make the best out of ns. There will also be those who will screw things up for everyone, including themselves.

 

I think today's generation of NSF can be quite jialat. Take for example the recent mama's boy who drive his mama's cabriolet(I wonder if it's that little boy in the E46 thread). Anything not happy with his ns life or not happy with his csm he would call his mama and mama call up mindef or something. Perhaps ppl's background has improved a lot over the years, ppl got money, anything not happy can find lawyer. They also look down on those WO and senior specialists, thinking they earn less dan their parents.

 

 

[Kspchew]

MR loh.....

NS taught me very well in.......... taking cover......... do things but dont get caught....

[Vidz]

NS at least taught us how to be street smart, something never learnt in school and something really valuable when in society... useful or not depends on individual... if keng all the way even after NS, then quite a loser...

 

NS, at least 2-3 decades back, was part defence, but also part cheap security guard, part cheap labour, part wayang (show of force). that is why locals don't really value. Not sure about now, but things must have improved... our commanders are quite highly valued... but I suspect now they are more scare of "whitehorse" than last time... see jack's movie

Edited March 21, 2013 by Vidz

[Latio2005A]

NS taught me many valuable lessons. Never forget.

 

Went to OCS, kena tekan, kena 2 weeks of RP for a damned stupid occurrence, came out strong, and more learned.

 

There are clowns and wayang kings (including a couple of "Scholars") when serving in unit, but many are truly intelligent. Overall good experience.

[Zenithpool]

no regret for going thru that 2.5hrs too. thou had some life-long injury, but still no regret. at least, move my perspective and mindset from Ah boy to Man

[Royho1979]

That Tan Sheng Hui guy got a good break found a job overseas and he assumed that his situation is replicable, despite the fact that the very fact he needs to use himself as an example means that is the exception rather than the norm. The company he now works in need him for hard skills rather than analytically skills, because his logic flow is juvenile.

 

I also found his statement below flawed.

 

"I am a valued contributor in these organisations because the very same leadership skills, teamwork, perseverance and discipline that I acquired in the SAF are equally applicable in NGO work, international diplomacy and development, and investment banking"

 

 

If the same leadership skills, teamwork, perseverance and discipline are applicable to the fields he named, that means those generic skills could be developed and honed in those exact industries and roles while someone acquire hard skills that complements. So his point is silly.

 

I did a quick search and I have not found examples of Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley offering roles to any of our prior BGs and Admirals who must be at the absolute pinnacle of "leadership skills, teamwork, perseverance and discipline" that is gained form SAF. Unsupported claims.

[Benarsenal]

For a conscript military, I feel that our NSMen are not accorded a very good level of respect. In terms of pay, it seems like a way of Govt having cheap labour, and we can't do anything about it.

 

In other countries, people in the military command total and utter respect, nearly equal or even on higher level than your standard office executive.

[Altivo]

Saw his profile on Linkedin. Impressive indeed

 

http://www.linkedin.com/in/alvinshenghuitan

 

Former tank commander.

 

Worked for UN.

 

Now with Goldman Sachs

Edited March 21, 2013 by Altivo

[Zenithpool]

For a conscript military, I feel that our NSMen are not accorded a very good level of respect. In terms of pay, it seems like a way of Govt having cheap labour, and we can't do anything about it.

 

In other countries, people in the military command total and utter respect, nearly equal or even on higher level than your standard office executive.

US don say, even some of the country like Indonesia, Thailand and Taiwan where I trained together with the Army, we receive great respect even from the commoners.

 

In sg, take MRT also kana stomp

[Pyramid_sg]

no regret for going thru that 2.5hrs too. thou had some life-long injury, but still no regret. at least, move my perspective and mindset from Ah boy to Man

 

Shortest NS time served ever........

[Nullifi3d]

Mr Tan did not say what was his vocation nor which service he was in.

 

Anywaz good for him that he finds his experience opening doors for him overseas.

 

The rest of us or at least me seriously do not find our society truly appreciating our 2 or 2.5 years' sacrifice and subsequently reservist obligations

 

Guess some 80-dollar vouchers is some kind of recognisation I reckon....

 

From ST Forum:

 

http://www.straitstimes.com/premium/forum-...rs-him-20130321

 

Military service opened doors for him

Published on Mar 21, 2013

 

"TELL me about your military experience."

 

I have been asked this question repeatedly at interviews for schools and work throughout the world. And I have learnt that the very best global institutions value my military skills, discipline and teamwork.

 

I started out poorly. After faring badly in junior college and being rejected by local universities, I enlisted for national service and, after my basic military training, decided to sign on with the Singapore Armed Forces (SAF). I hoped to use my military service to bolster my applications for overseas universities.

 

The skills and experience that I gained in the SAF helped me break through seemingly impossible odds.

 

I was offered a place in a foreign university, got my degree, returned to the SAF, and left after serving my four-year bond.

 

I subsequently applied for and was accepted to a top United States graduate programme, then worked in non-governmental organisations (NGOs), international organisations and financial institutions.

 

I have been in no way disadvantaged or "behind my peers".

 

I am a valued contributor in these organisations because the very same leadership skills, teamwork, perseverance and discipline that I acquired in the SAF are equally applicable in NGO work, international diplomacy and development, and investment banking.

 

What is worth noting, however, is that, in my experience, local institutions value these skills and experience less. Where global institutions saw these as strengths, local ones generally did not. This must change.

 

Ultimately, regardless of the value we may or may not extract from national service, it helps to pause and reflect on the privilege of serving in the defence of one's loved ones and country.

 

And we should, perhaps, remember that young men (and women) considered it a privilege, duty and necessity to serve at the advent and formation of the earliest nation states and civilisations.

 

Tan Sheng Hui

 

Tell that to the countless ex-regulars working as insurance agents.

 

[Royho1979]

Saw his profile on Linkedin. Impressive indeed

 

http://www.linkedin.com/in/alvinshenghuitan

 

Former tank commander.

 

Worked for UN.

 

Now with Goldman Sachs

 

Well its obvious its the Harvard not the SAF on his resume that gave him his break in life.

[Moredhel]

Saw his profile on Linkedin. Impressive indeed

 

http://www.linkedin.com/in/alvinshenghuitan

 

Former tank commander.

 

Worked for UN.

 

Now with Goldman Sachs

 

Indeed.

 

But filling up the holes in his timeline, how many people can make it to OCS, much less be given the chance for a scholarship, more so in a non-related field of study away from your military designated estab.

 

And from tank commander become intelligence analyst? Totally unrelated fields and impossible without someone high up backing this move. And he's politically very sound, looking at first the PAP linked activities and further down, the founding of groups with political voices in a respected institution.

 

I would say that his guy is very smart and knows how to create opportunities, but he also has the devil's own luck and connections from political affilations that most Singaporeans don't.

 

 

All in all, a model success of the 'meritocratic' environment here. And I would further venture to say that I think without certain affiliations as a spring board for him, he won't be where he is now.

[Altivo]

Well its obvious its the Harvard not the SAF on his resume that gave him his break in life.

 

I second that as well. Harvard was the one that opened the doors for him.

 

Anyway, most foreigners are intrigued and would then to ask more questions when they realised if you had served with an Armed Forces previously. I've always have foreign colleagues asking about how it is like to be in the military (I was only an NSF).