Property in Johor

[Enye]

anyone who made money of overseas properties is pure luck on FX rate. 

 

anyone who can accurately predict the rate in excess of a year .. is either God himself... or...   sry.. no other superlatives superbored

 

[HP_Lee]

Nope. I differ. You don't need to predict for currency move. I can't do that either. One buy a property for 10 or more years. Over a that period many things can happen. Future is not for us to predict or pure luck. All rates are transparent. Many are still home base. But it is not easy in Singapore to make that big swing. In Singapore,I just have to wait for a repeat crises, like one happen in Australia last 2- 3 years, where developers did some degree of fire sales.

That's what I did many years ago on my JB property. During the early 2000, no one border to touch. And people commented, crazy. 

 

Recently, mass local properties experience only a slight downward trend, after a rocket spike over the last 7 - 8 years. So I still wait, and not mind to miss the train. If that yield I would rather stick to my liquid portfolio that gives me 6 - 8%, and 40% cash. That gives me flexibility to take on crises opportunities. Rather than local ill-liquid property that gives only 3% or less, after going through all trouble. I believe it will come, but strange enough, almost every crises comes when many get caught off guarded. That's where those liquid comes in handy. Yes, you may say equities too will go down as well. Again that depends at what price is purchase and years experience counts. I can liquidate fast enough.  I would not leak further from here.   

 

 

anyone who made money of overseas properties is pure luck on FX rate. 

 

anyone who can accurately predict the rate in excess of a year .. is either God himself... or...   sry.. no other superlatives 

 

[Freeder]

 

 

even got big chinese poster!

 

Forest City Iskandar Malaysia development Update 22 April 2017 YouTube.png

 

 

Jib kor really selling out his country to the max...

[HP_Lee]

Normally, I never trust this sort of selling by the Chinese. I am very weary about such selling. Many got mixed up with 2 countries' government collaboration and individual as a individual investor. On government to government level is different from individual level, in terms of investments.

 

 

even got big chinese poster!

 

Forest City Iskandar Malaysia development Update 22 April 2017 YouTube.png

 

 

 

 

Edited May 15, 2017 by HP_Lee

[AuntAnnie]

Beside considering Johor, consider other relating country like UK, Australia sound much better especially your kids can study aboard and save the hostel fees. who knows! u may go there for a holiday in your holiday home

[Zxcvb]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyM7BzLLeu8

 

News report potray like very rosy tag on the trending term "belt and road".

[Jamesc]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyM7BzLLeu8

 

News report potray like very rosy tag on the trending term "belt and road".

 

Iskandar and Forest City will be a failure

 

I look forward to living there. One whole

 

tower maybe a few occupied only. I don't mind

 

surrounded by empty apartments. Less noise. 

 

[Staff69]

 

Iskandar Malaysia Property Investments – 5 Reasons Why They’re a Bad Idea

 

By aaron loy

January 3, 2015

198

2

Share:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Image Source: http://www.iskandarmalaysia.com.my/our-development-plan

A few months back, I entertained the thought of buying a property in Iskandar Malaysia, either as a home for myself, or as a rental property. The relatively weak Malaysian Ringgit makes it a very enticing proposition, but while personal factors (like location of friends, lack of personal transport and poor internet infrastructure) ruled out my using the property as a home, I also quickly realized that it’s also a very bad idea to buy one as an investment.

Now, I don’t pretend to be an expert in property investmenting, but what I do have however, are insights as the son of a real estate agent, and my penchant for (overly?) anal-analytical thinking.

So why is investing in Properties in Iskandar Malaysia currently a bad idea? Here are some of my reasons:

 

1. Limits on Foreigners

There are 2 parts to this.

The 1st one, which is arguably superficial, is that in every project, certain units are always reserved for the local Malay populace. There are informally called ‘Bumi Units’, named after the ‘Bumiputera‘, the policy. You can read more about it here.

In practice, you’ll find that some of the best units will not be available for purchase because you’re not a local Malay. An annoyance for those buying for yourselves, though probably not as big of an issue if you’re planning to rent the place (There are of course loopholes to get around the problem, but we’ll focus on the ‘official’ stuff only, yea?).

The most important thing though, is that foreigners are only allowed to buy property above a certain limit. It was RM500,000, and as of 3rd March’14, it has been raised to RM1,000,000.

Understandably, this is to prevent rapid rise in prices due to over-speculation, which is a good thing for the locals. As an investor however, this will be a problem for your exit strategy, which we’ll talk about later.

 

2. Are Businesses Moving In? Who are your Tenants?

Iskandar Malaysia is being sold as a holistic nirvana where anybody can work, play, and live a balanced life.

Be that as it may, there’s 1 fundamental a lot of new investors miss when they’re considering an investment here; Are businesses moving in?

Think about it. In any new town, businesses must set up shop first before the people (employees of these businesses) move in. I’m not sure that’s the case with this region.

The next time you bring yourself and/or your family along to Johor for your shopping and seafood, keep your eyes open and pay attention to the commercial spaces. Are the shops doing well? Are their customers mostly locals or weekender Singaporeans? Where are the offices, warehouses and other non-retail spaces? Are they filled or mostly empty? etc.

This is important information because you need to figure out who’s going to rent your property and if there’s demand. From what I see so far, demand from local business staff is extremely low.

The other side of this argument is that because of the increasing cost of living in Singapore, more people will starting living cross-causeway livelihoods, working in Singapore while staying in Johor. A valid point, I concede, but honestly, when will the demand start to rise?

How many are willing to spend the extra time, at least twice a day, 5 times a week, enduring traffic jams going to and fro work via the check points? Until Singapore and Malaysia stop bickering and solve this fundamental logistical issue can large scale cross-causeway livelihoods become a reality. This, and the recent measures to (finally) increase supply of houses in Singapore, means that most people will still opt to stay here.

So, who’s going to rent your property?

 

3. Competition Against Other Investors

I shall attempt to figure out why you’re thinking of investing in Iskandar Malaysia with the help of my crystal ball… let’s see now…. mmmm……. ahhh… I see…:

1. You’re new to property investing

2. Malaysia is still ‘familiar’ territory compared to, say, the Philippines or Vietnam

3. Properties in Malaysia are much cheaper than those in Singapore (2.5x cheaper sial!)

4. No Money Down (It seems like the Malaysian government is cracking down on this loophole though)

…. close?

Hey, don’t take it personally. Knowing yourself is half the battle won yes? I’m in the same boat as you =)

With that done… do you see a problem?

We’ve already established that rental demand isn’t exactly hot in that area right now, yes? And yet, it seems like housing in Iskandar is (or was?) selling quite well, and I suspect, to those with the same mindset as you and me.

So, not only do we have questionable demand, but we also seem to have an oversupply of new wannabe ‘investors’ trying to rent as well, which means there will be a large supply of rental properties in the market, and a large supple would mean lower rentals and a lower return on investment, isn’t it?

Mmmm… Singapore Dollars looking Delicious

4. Cheap Investment?

One of my pet peeves is that the word ‘cheap’ is often misused. It’s often used to denote ‘low priced’ when it should mean ‘low for its price’ instead. Let’s put it this way, buying a $1,000,000 sports car that costs $2,000,000 to make is ‘cheap’, while $7.90 for the same nail clipper that can be bought for $2 at a pasar malam (night market) is called ‘expensive’. Price ≠ Actual Value.

Anyway…

A similar problem plagues the mindset of the wannabe investors who are exploring the possibility of investing in Iskandarian properties; They (or We, I should say) feel that these projects are ‘cheap’ because they’re ‘cheaper’ than properties in Singapore.

In my opinion, Iskandar Malaysia is, especially their residential projects, in effect, like Batam Island, in that they’re made to cater to Singaporean cash cows who are willing to be milked. In other words, most of it is hype, with inflated prices and an excess of fake demand.

 

5. Exit Strategy?

Let’s say, for whatever reason, the time has come for you to sell this property of yours. Now, before we talk about making or losing money, let’s talk about the 2 primary factors that will effect your ability to do so:

The RM1,000,000 lower purchase limit on foreigners, and the fact that most properties launched are priced between RM500,000 and RM1,000,000.

Oops.

You have to remember that these projects are not made to be affordable for the locals; They’re there to maximize profits from foreigners (read: Singaporeans) with cash to spare. So, unless the government lowers the limit or there’s a miracle spike in property prices, the limit effectively eliminates all foreigners as potential buyers for your property.

How can you sell.. when there are no buyers?

 

Conclusion

1. Limits on foreigners that limits choices.

2. A practically non-existent rental market.

3. Competing against a large pool of ‘investors’ for a small pool of tenants.

4. Bad value for money.

5. Effectively, no way out of this investment.

Honestly, all one needs to do is to ask some simple questions and do a little research to know that investing in Iskandar Malaysian properties is, at best, a questionable move to make. There are too many things working against you and expecting any of those factors to change is almost akin to gambling, hoping for a good card to appear.

Investing may be a game, but it’s a game you want to win by making informed choices.

There’s a word for taking chances and hoping for the best: Gambling.

At the moment, in my humble opinion, the local government and the property developers made a killing while the ultimate losers are those who bought units before the limit increased to RM1,000,000. These people are stuck with a property that’s extremely difficult sell or rent to break even, much less make a profit out of.

Here’s the thing though; There IS a potential for that place. After all, with the cost of living in Singapore on the rise and its government’s penchant for taking short-cuts to solve its population problem, an increasing number of people will consider staying around Iskandar Malaysia as a permanent compromise between convenience and lower cost of living.

That being said, I believe that the potential will only be realised in the relatively far future, and things will only get much worst before it becomes a viable investment option.

I hope this ‘layman’s’ take on the subject has given some insight into the topic. Remember to share this post, especially with those who are considering a purchase in the area.

Do check out another take on the same topic @ Dr Wealth: Iskandar Malaysia is Only Going One Way – Down. Research is always important, yes?

 

http://www.theaaronloy.com/iskandar-malaysia-property-investments-5-reasons-why-theyre-a-bad-idea/

[BanCoe]

Iskandar and Forest City will be a failure

 

I look forward to living there. One whole

 

tower maybe a few occupied only. I don't mind

 

surrounded by empty apartments. Less noise. 

 

.... of course your doting MIL will sweeten it even further ........  

   "Home Sweet Home" 

[Sunny]

.... of course your doting MIL will sweeten it even further ........  

   "Home Sweet Home" 

 

 

buy liao everyday/night home sweat home 

[HP_Lee]

This reasons is only partially applicable to investor who is a foreigner. As mentioned, anything above RM500k is not wise to purchase. But if you investor via trusted close relative who is a Malaysian, than it make sense. That is what I am looking into.  When almost everyone is pessimistic, one will able to easily find great value. 

I have started investing out of Singapore, because of value. Moving forward, it is not easy to achieve good returns in Singapore. The premiums is high, and everyone is so competitive in terms of market acknowledge. With high premiums one paid for and after all deductibles, one may achieve 2 -3.5% annualized. Why taking all troubles to invest a private property here, there one can park money in almost risk-free CPF SA/OA.? On top of this, one can sleep well without worrying market/technology disruption.

 

We are heading to gig economy where there are more shorter term jobs, sharing economy. The days of stable job is getting harder to come-by. Things are changing faster than anyone is aware of. As a developed economy, we are seeing more automation/robots replacing people. This is already a sign of business not as usual. More AI automation are encroaching into higher educated professionals space. Therefore, lesser jobs means less consumer(Human) spending.With less spending, means you do not need more retail. 

 

But not forgetting the high-end properties in Singapore well do well. To them, may not be for investments. It is a play ground for them to enjoy the security aspects.

 

Developing countries, like Malaysia which is not stable create opportunities. I bought into an Australian property a year+ ago, because the developer was disparate off-loading it. It was due to the after crash in oil prices 3 years ago. This is the first time I bought into a developed country.  

 

 

 

 

Iskandar Malaysia Property Investments – 5 Reasons Why They’re a Bad Idea

By aaron loy
January 3, 2015
198
2
Share:













Image Source: http://www.iskandarmalaysia.com.my/our-development-plan
A few months back, I entertained the thought of buying a property in Iskandar Malaysia, either as a home for myself, or as a rental property. The relatively weak Malaysian Ringgit makes it a very enticing proposition, but while personal factors (like location of friends, lack of personal transport and poor internet infrastructure) ruled out my using the property as a home, I also quickly realized that it’s also a very bad idea to buy one as an investment.
Now, I don’t pretend to be an expert in property investmenting, but what I do have however, are insights as the son of a real estate agent, and my penchant for (overly?) anal-analytical thinking.
So why is investing in Properties in Iskandar Malaysia currently a bad idea? Here are some of my reasons:

1. Limits on Foreigners
There are 2 parts to this.
The 1st one, which is arguably superficial, is that in every project, certain units are always reserved for the local Malay populace. There are informally called ‘Bumi Units’, named after the ‘Bumiputera‘, the policy. You can read more about it here.
In practice, you’ll find that some of the best units will not be available for purchase because you’re not a local Malay. An annoyance for those buying for yourselves, though probably not as big of an issue if you’re planning to rent the place (There are of course loopholes to get around the problem, but we’ll focus on the ‘official’ stuff only, yea?).
The most important thing though, is that foreigners are only allowed to buy property above a certain limit. It was RM500,000, and as of 3rd March’14, it has been raised to RM1,000,000.
Understandably, this is to prevent rapid rise in prices due to over-speculation, which is a good thing for the locals. As an investor however, this will be a problem for your exit strategy, which we’ll talk about later.

2. Are Businesses Moving In? Who are your Tenants?
Iskandar Malaysia is being sold as a holistic nirvana where anybody can work, play, and live a balanced life.
Be that as it may, there’s 1 fundamental a lot of new investors miss when they’re considering an investment here; Are businesses moving in?
Think about it. In any new town, businesses must set up shop first before the people (employees of these businesses) move in. I’m not sure that’s the case with this region.
The next time you bring yourself and/or your family along to Johor for your shopping and seafood, keep your eyes open and pay attention to the commercial spaces. Are the shops doing well? Are their customers mostly locals or weekender Singaporeans? Where are the offices, warehouses and other non-retail spaces? Are they filled or mostly empty? etc.
This is important information because you need to figure out who’s going to rent your property and if there’s demand. From what I see so far, demand from local business staff is extremely low.
The other side of this argument is that because of the increasing cost of living in Singapore, more people will starting living cross-causeway livelihoods, working in Singapore while staying in Johor. A valid point, I concede, but honestly, when will the demand start to rise?
How many are willing to spend the extra time, at least twice a day, 5 times a week, enduring traffic jams going to and fro work via the check points? Until Singapore and Malaysia stop bickering and solve this fundamental logistical issue can large scale cross-causeway livelihoods become a reality. This, and the recent measures to (finally) increase supply of houses in Singapore, means that most people will still opt to stay here.
So, who’s going to rent your property?

3. Competition Against Other Investors
I shall attempt to figure out why you’re thinking of investing in Iskandar Malaysia with the help of my crystal ball… let’s see now…. mmmm……. ahhh… I see…:
1. You’re new to property investing
2. Malaysia is still ‘familiar’ territory compared to, say, the Philippines or Vietnam
3. Properties in Malaysia are much cheaper than those in Singapore (2.5x cheaper sial!)
4. No Money Down (It seems like the Malaysian government is cracking down on this loophole though)
…. close?
Hey, don’t take it personally. Knowing yourself is half the battle won yes? I’m in the same boat as you =)
With that done… do you see a problem?
We’ve already established that rental demand isn’t exactly hot in that area right now, yes? And yet, it seems like housing in Iskandar is (or was?) selling quite well, and I suspect, to those with the same mindset as you and me.
So, not only do we have questionable demand, but we also seem to have an oversupply of new wannabe ‘investors’ trying to rent as well, which means there will be a large supply of rental properties in the market, and a large supple would mean lower rentals and a lower return on investment, isn’t it?

Mmmm… Singapore Dollars looking Delicious
4. Cheap Investment?
One of my pet peeves is that the word ‘cheap’ is often misused. It’s often used to denote ‘low priced’ when it should mean ‘low for its price’ instead. Let’s put it this way, buying a $1,000,000 sports car that costs $2,000,000 to make is ‘cheap’, while $7.90 for the same nail clipper that can be bought for $2 at a pasar malam (night market) is called ‘expensive’. Price ≠ Actual Value.
Anyway…
A similar problem plagues the mindset of the wannabe investors who are exploring the possibility of investing in Iskandarian properties; They (or We, I should say) feel that these projects are ‘cheap’ because they’re ‘cheaper’ than properties in Singapore.
In my opinion, Iskandar Malaysia is, especially their residential projects, in effect, like Batam Island, in that they’re made to cater to Singaporean cash cows who are willing to be milked. In other words, most of it is hype, with inflated prices and an excess of fake demand.

5. Exit Strategy?
Let’s say, for whatever reason, the time has come for you to sell this property of yours. Now, before we talk about making or losing money, let’s talk about the 2 primary factors that will effect your ability to do so:
The RM1,000,000 lower purchase limit on foreigners, and the fact that most properties launched are priced between RM500,000 and RM1,000,000.
Oops.
You have to remember that these projects are not made to be affordable for the locals; They’re there to maximize profits from foreigners (read: Singaporeans) with cash to spare. So, unless the government lowers the limit or there’s a miracle spike in property prices, the limit effectively eliminates all foreigners as potential buyers for your property.
How can you sell.. when there are no buyers?

Conclusion
1. Limits on foreigners that limits choices.
2. A practically non-existent rental market.
3. Competing against a large pool of ‘investors’ for a small pool of tenants.
4. Bad value for money.
5. Effectively, no way out of this investment.
Honestly, all one needs to do is to ask some simple questions and do a little research to know that investing in Iskandar Malaysian properties is, at best, a questionable move to make. There are too many things working against you and expecting any of those factors to change is almost akin to gambling, hoping for a good card to appear.
Investing may be a game, but it’s a game you want to win by making informed choices.
There’s a word for taking chances and hoping for the best: Gambling.
At the moment, in my humble opinion, the local government and the property developers made a killing while the ultimate losers are those who bought units before the limit increased to RM1,000,000. These people are stuck with a property that’s extremely difficult sell or rent to break even, much less make a profit out of.
Here’s the thing though; There IS a potential for that place. After all, with the cost of living in Singapore on the rise and its government’s penchant for taking short-cuts to solve its population problem, an increasing number of people will consider staying around Iskandar Malaysia as a permanent compromise between convenience and lower cost of living.
That being said, I believe that the potential will only be realised in the relatively far future, and things will only get much worst before it becomes a viable investment option.
I hope this ‘layman’s’ take on the subject has given some insight into the topic. Remember to share this post, especially with those who are considering a purchase in the area.
Do check out another take on the same topic @ Dr Wealth: Iskandar Malaysia is Only Going One Way – Down. Research is always important, yes?

http://www.theaaronloy.com/iskandar-malaysia-property-investments-5-reasons-why-theyre-a-bad-idea/

 

 

[Datsun366]

For those of us with ties up north,

we know better.

Staff69 is absolutely correct.

 

Why would small dog like me seriously consider 21 acres in the US or NZ and not PJ?

Why ah?

 

James it's not going to be empty but you would not want to live with your neighbors, whoever they may be....

The nightmare on Genting, Amber alert.

[Jamesc]

I got close relatives in Msia

 

If anyone wants to use their name

 

to put the property under them

 

I can help. 

 

[Aaronlkl]

I got close relatives in Msia

 

If anyone wants to use their name

 

to put the property under them

 

I can help. 

 

 

Got ppl so chee-tu-pit one meh? Buy property in the name of an unrelated person.

 

Even if the person is ur close relative, u better think twice b4 u proceed.

 

[Windwaver]

Got ppl so chee-tu-pit one meh? Buy property in the name of an unrelated person.

 

Even if the person is ur close relative, u better think twice b4 u proceed.

 

 

I'm not "2Fast2Furious" yet

[Aaronlkl]

I'm not "2Fast2Furious" yet

 

 

Wat toking u?

[BanCoe]

Yeap dont get into proxy or 3rd party or Trust deed  things in Malaysia ... expecially with Property in foreign Land

Lots of jurisdiction issues will crop up later on

 

Though some say its safer to buy in name of Company (incorporation).... i really don't know how this things work out 

A friend of mine bought a property here with friends in a Company name (Pte Ltd) so they have like shares in the property

 

Got ppl so chee-tu-pit one meh? Buy property in the name of an unrelated person.

 

Even if the person is ur close relative, u better think twice b4 u proceed.

 

 

[Windwaver]

Wat toking u?

 

Me 6th gear nia so still far from "2Fast2Furious".

 

Many people I know that got stuck in properties in some parts of Malaysia just went in "2Fast2Furious" .

 

I knew something is wrong when a developer friend of mine in Malaysia told me not to buy.