Harrier 2017

[Hobbes187]

1 hour ago, Kokho said:

 

Mid December just two week ago, later going to bargain more discounts from SE.

Do note that the promo price advertised in mid Dec then was 129k. Now is 133k.

I managed to get another 1k discount after bargain plus more freebies. so realistically they can go down to $132 or so now.

[Powxus]

Rumour the new model launching in mid 2020.

[ferrytales]

18 hours ago, Hobbes187 said:

I got mine at $128k after over trade $13k + bargaining for extra discount. Plus other freebies added. 

That was in mid Dec. Condition was to register by 31 Dec. Think the SE said they need to meet some 2019 quota by year end... They let me collect 3 business days after coe bidding.

Think now back up to 133k even though coe went down 2k since no more quota to meet.

 

Harrier cost price is 85k for M grade and 98k for G grade, recent COE cat B 36k or open cat at 37k. 

Wow 128k with 13k overtrade, what is borneo even earning? doesn't make sense they are selling at a deficit either. 

[Hobbes187]

I guess if they really want to meet certain quota promised to Toyota Japan, then they will be willing to reduce margin on a few units to hit that. They only had that one last Coe bid in 2019 to hit the target so must be pretty tight.

Probably the overall benefits to the company is higher than the X units that they make less in. Frankly I don't care even if they make a loss to sell to me as long as I get a good price. Haha.

I asked if the same over trade extended to camry or rav4 but they said only for Harrier and for X number of units (can't remember how many).

Edited December 28, 2019 by Hobbes187

[13177]

30 minutes ago, Hobbes187 said:

I guess if they really want to meet certain quota promised to Toyota Japan, then they will be willing to reduce margin on a few units to hit that. They only had that one last Coe bid in 2019 to hit the target so must be pretty tight.

Probably the overall benefits to the company is higher than the X units that they make less in. Frankly I don't care even if they make a loss to sell to me as long as I get a good price. Haha.

I asked if the same over trade extended to camry or rav4 but they said only for Harrier and for X number of units (can't remember how many).

I guess rav4 and camry still quite new to have such promo yet. Lol.

[Hobbes187]

Quite a few ppl msg me regarding the price I got. To make things clear, it was $142k minus $13k over trade discount minus additional discounts to get to 128k. Not 128k minus 13k over trade.😅

Basically the over trade is just a discount if u trade in. But the trade in price given was close to what I was quoted outside so they didn't give a lousy trade in price to compensate the over trade discount.

[Hobbes187]

Also there were some questions on this "over trade" term. It is basically extra discount if u trade in your car. E.g. If your car is 50k value, they take in at 63k (for 13k over trade).

It is not any kind of balloon scheme to get more loan. Think this term is quite confusing.

[ferrytales]

1 hour ago, Hobbes187 said:

Quite a few ppl msg me regarding the price I got. To make things clear, it was $142k minus $13k over trade discount minus additional discounts to get to 128k. Not 128k minus 13k over trade.😅

Basically the over trade is just a discount if u trade in. But the trade in price given was close to what I was quoted outside so they didn't give a lousy trade in price to compensate the over trade discount.

Now it makes sense cause list price is 140k+. The overtrade is just a marketing gimmick to make you feel shiok that you "traded in" your old car at a high price. Overtrade is not exactly a discount I guess. Will be great if you can share the overall breakdown and whether you took any loans etc. 

Edited December 28, 2019 by ferrytales

[Hobbes187]

I tend to look at the final price and roughly how much premium I'm paying over cost. Based on the cost price u provided, at 36k coe, the cost is 121k. So the premium we are paying is only 7k or 5.4%. To me that is one of the lowest premium I have paid on a new car. The other models I looked at were like 15-25%.

So doesn't matter if it is considered discount or not. Can also take it as the car is listed at 128k (or 133k today).😁

PS: just remembered i got $500 petrol voucher from the deal too. $200 for trade in and $300 from spin the wheel thingy.

Edited December 28, 2019 by Hobbes187

[GTO-1]

21 minutes ago, ferrytales said:

Now it makes sense cause list price is 140k+. The overtrade is just a marketing gimmick to make you feel shiok that you "traded in" your old car at a high price. Overtrade is not exactly a discount I guess. Will be great if you can share the overall breakdown and whether you took any loans etc. 

Overtrade seems to be an exclusive SG thing. If you actually look at the math, the dealer just had extra fat in their margins to allow them to eat into it. But to the buyer the SE is saying: "I give you this amazing deal for your old car, that no one is else giving".

If your cars trade in value is $10k, then it's no different in them saying, "I'll give you over trade of $13k" vs "I'll take your car for $10k, but give you $3k additional discount off purchase price". 

Overtrade is just another toolkit in the SE's toolbox to make you feel special, but in reality they are just playing with their margins. 

[Hobbes187]

26 minutes ago, GTO-1 said:

Overtrade seems to be an exclusive SG thing. If you actually look at the math, the dealer just had extra fat in their margins to allow them to eat into it. But to the buyer the SE is saying: "I give you this amazing deal for your old car, that no one is else giving".

If your cars trade in value is $10k, then it's no different in them saying, "I'll give you over trade of $13k" vs "I'll take your car for $10k, but give you $3k additional discount off purchase price". 

Overtrade is just another toolkit in the SE's toolbox to make you feel special, but in reality they are just playing with their margins. 

Agreed. That's why I think just look at the final price and premium paid.

But I think the part where u said over trade 13k is as good as 10k trade in + 3k discount isn't totally accurate.

For me I got quotes of 86k for my old car from outside (carro, secondhand dealers). BM also quoted about this price for trade in. So in your example it should be 10k trade in + 13k discount.

[GTO-1]

32 minutes ago, Hobbes187 said:

Agreed. That's why I think just look at the final price and premium paid.

But I think the part where u said over trade 13k is as good as 10k trade in + 3k discount isn't totally accurate.

For me I got quotes of 86k for my old car from outside (carro, secondhand dealers). BM also quoted about this price for trade in. So in your example it should be 10k trade in + 13k discount.

Wasn't using your numbers per se. Just took some generic numbers to illustrate that overtrade is just a way for dealers to make it seem like they are giving buyers a better deal, when all it is, is that they are playing variables in their already thick margins. 

The thing is, so many people fall for the trick. I personally know of several people that bought from a dealer just because they felt they are getting a better "overtrade" than another dealer. 

I know of one couple that were choosing between two cars, and bought the more expensive car only because that dealer offered them a "larger" overtrade. 

Edited December 28, 2019 by GTO-1

[Hamburger]

In a nutshell, is 13k overtrade a straight discount or simply helping potential owners to make purchase with a 13k upfront  cash assist? 

 

If it's the  latter,  then is a gimmick. 

[GTO-1]

14 minutes ago, Hamburger said:

In a nutshell, is 13k overtrade a straight discount or simply helping potential owners to make purchase with a 13k upfront  cash assist? 

 

If it's the  latter,  then is a gimmick. 

Overtrade is a gimmick. But it's a powerful one, and with a good salesperson, they can use it depending on how naive a buyer is, to make a sale. 

Let's say management allows an SE about $5k in discounts, overtrade or freebies. Then the SE can tell a prospective buyer that they will give them $1k cash discount, $1k in freebies and $3k overtrade. For one type of buyer they will think this is amazing. The same SE could get another buyer with no car to trade and give them $4k discount and $1k freebies. 

In both cases, management gets their margins, SE gets their sales and buyer gets a perspective that they got a good deal, even though it's all the same just positioned differently. 

The strategy for the buyer is therefore to strike when management is willing to give steeper discounts (eg. Year or quarterly end and needing to hit target, or stock clearance due to new models).  But it's naive to think that a single mainstream buyer is getting a special deal. 

Edited December 28, 2019 by GTO-1

[Hobbes187]

18 minutes ago, Hamburger said:

In a nutshell, is 13k overtrade a straight discount or simply helping potential owners to make purchase with a 13k upfront  cash assist? 

 

If it's the  latter,  then is a gimmick. 

Like what GTO mentioned, it is playing around with the margin. They are able to sell the car at 128k but mark it up to 141k then give a "over trade" discount to push it back down.

Not sure if it helps one to get more loan this way cos I took minimal amount.

[Hobbes187]

14 minutes ago, GTO-1 said:

Overtrade is a gimmick. But it's a powerful one, and with a good salesperson, they can use it depending on how naive a buyer is, to make a sale. 

Let's say management allows an SE about $5k in discounts, overtrade or freebies. Then the SE can tell a prospective buyer that they will give them $1k cash discount, $1k in freebies and $3k overtrade. For one type of buyer they will think this is amazing. The same SE could get another buyer with no car to trade and give them $4k discount and $1k freebies. 

In both cases, management gets their margins, SE gets their sales and buyer gets a perspective that they got a good deal, even though it's all the same just positioned differently. 

The strategy for the buyer is therefore to strike when management is willing to give steeper discounts (eg. Year or quarterly end and needing to hit target, or stock clearance due to new models).  But it's naive to think that a single mainstream buyer is getting a special deal. 

I agree it is a common strategy employed by AD. If u go conti AD, these "over trades" can go over 20k for some models.

That's why I keep stressing to look past these and focus on the final price we are paying. That gives an indication how much margin AD is making and whether it is truly a good deal.

PS: I'm also not suggesting this is a special deal that only selected people got. Any buyer who went to BM 2 weeks ago would have gotten similar deals. In fact the promo now is not far off.

[Hamburger]

32 minutes ago, Hobbes187 said:

Like what GTO mentioned, it is playing around with the margin. They are able to sell the car at 128k but mark it up to 141k then give a "over trade" discount to push it back down.

Not sure if it helps one to get more loan this way cos I took minimal amount.

Confusion aside, what is your nett purchase price then?

[Hobbes187]

1 minute ago, Hamburger said:

Confusion aside, what is your nett purchase price then?

$128k was the nett after everything factored in. Trade in value of car was similar to what was quoted by outside.