Help pours in for family of 9 living on under S$3k

[Voodooman]

Thinking deeper, and I find it nothing wrong seeking financial help coping with their large family. Although not financially prudent to have 7 kids on a 3k income, it is their choice. They are entitled to tap on whatever available legal financial aid available to them.

 

 

"Entitled to" and possibly depriving others who did not make those bad life choice of help? I think that is wrong but we can agree to disagree. Edited July 8, 2018 by Voodooman

[Voodooman]

It's easy to make informed decision based on considerations that are tangible.

 

The intangibles are often overlooked.

Just don't earn $1000 and spent $1200, you can have all the intangibles you want in life.

[inlinesix]

Govt should support this family (not just financially).

 

Not a lot of family willing to have 7 kids.

 

By supporting this family, this will sent a positive pro-family message.

 

It is better than any PR job.

[Mazda2gal]

In general, financial assistance is granted based on:

1. Per capita monthly income

2. Willingness to apply

 

Encountered ppl from extremes:

1. Boy staying in bungalow is under financial assistance, reason? Father retired, therefore no income. Though family's net worth is probably higher than majority in the country, they qualify for financial assistance and they applied for it.

2. Odd job labourer is single parent to 2 boys with severe ADHD, also has a old mother to be fed, yet refused to apply for financial assistance for his sons. Reason being? He is physically abled and can work, therefore he doesn't want to rely on help. Sometimes his son has no money for meals.

 

The system is there to help the real needy but there are loopholes for abuse. And sometimes the real needy do not get the support because they believe in not relying on help.

 

 

The program wishes to highlight that it's possible to raise 7 kids on 3k per month because help is available? Unlike the past when life was much simpler and families could raise many kids just by providing basic necessities, leaving the task of academic education almost entirely to the schools, nowadays kids need substantial family support to cope with schoolwork because of the rigour expected. Nowadays having 5 kids or more in a family isn't exactly uncommon, however if an analysis of academic performance of children from big families is conducted, it'll show a worrying pattern.

 

Of course parents can say they don't expect much of their children's school performance as long as they grow up healthy and happy. Yet we do know the realities of life, expectations of the society.

 

I hope children who are receiving financial support will NOT have the mindset that help is always available, it's OK not to be self sufficient, just depend on handouts from society. Because if they do, there's a high chance they'll become victims of the system.

[Silver_blade]

I feel it is okay if they receiving financial assistance cos of a sudden change in circumstances but it is irresponsible (no matter how you see it) if they already know their financial status and still continue to have more kids.

 

Yes it is their personal choice and it is perfectly ok if they are self sufficient (living whatever kind of lifestyle that may be) and do not need help from others. Otherwise they are no different from those young couple who got into debt cos of their lavish wedding photography/dinner and need family and friends to help them reduce/clear their debt.

[Silver_blade]

....Boy staying in bungalow is under financial assistance, reason? Father retired, therefore no income. Though family's net worth is probably higher than majority in the country, they qualify for financial assistance and they applied for it......

I know someone in similar situation. He was an odd job labourer but hasn’t been working for the past few years cos of poor health. He is receiving financial assistance and medical treatments but he is living in a house left behind by his late father. Social service did advice him to sell, to free up some cash and move into a flat. But he refused and there is nothing much they can do without being accused of cold-hearted.

 

So the country is paying for his daily needs, medical, property tax, etc.

[Piyopico]

Everyone knows that having less children and offering better quality care and higher financial resources per kid is good but if you sit down and ponder, not everyone is born to be a LKY, an engineer, lawyer or doctor.

 

It’s just like there are Merc, BMW, Toyota, Kia, and Geely, the roads can’t have only one type of vehicles.

We need Hiace, Vito and motorbikes to do the mundane but crucial work.

 

The country needs talents in every form and areas. We need more entrepreneurs and enterprising talents and it would appear many are born out of harsh backgrounds. We Dun need thousands of lawyers and bankers....... especially engineers. But we certainly require more people in industries that locals shun. Nurses, social workers, uniform services etc.

 

The welfare system is open to abuse. Which system is not?

 

The kids may be self entitled. Tell me which Singaporean is not? Self entitlement has already set in from a decade ago, kids from young all the way to pioneer citizens are mostly self entitled. This however is another topic altogether.

[Throttle2]

I think it is fair to say that nobody here in mcf have any issue with a couple having as many children as they can afford in terms of time and money.

 

But the line has to be drawn when your choice puts your children at a disadvantage that they did not asked to be born into and drawing upon public resources (tax money and welfare) that could have been better allocated to citizens who did not have a choice in their disadvantaged situation.

Agreed

I know someone in similar situation. He was an odd job labourer but hasn’t been working for the past few years cos of poor health. He is receiving financial assistance and medical treatments but he is living in a house left behind by his late father. Social service did advice him to sell, to free up some cash and move into a flat. But he refused and there is nothing much they can do without being accused of cold-hearted.

 

So the country is paying for his daily needs, medical, property tax, etc.

Fark that.

 

Its like a friend who lives in a fully paid D9 condo worth at least $3mil

Then he loses his job and cant find another and expects help from the system.

 

Go sell your possessions and all before asking for help.

We should not be subsidising someone who is asset rich cash poor.

Otherwise we are gone.

 

The State can help by assisting person in liquidating his assets at a fair market price and then allocating a HDB to him. With the cash unlock, he should no longer be living in poverty or hardship.

That is how it should and must be done.

 

Bottomline is, if you dont do what you can, dont expect others to do anything for you

Edited July 8, 2018 by Throttle2

[Vratenza]

There lies in the fallacy of your argument in that having  more resources being focused on the child means that he will have to be a LKY, engineer, lawyer or a doctor? 

 

Don't assume that single child family will not produce an upright well adjusted member of the society who is going to contribute back to the society as dedicated nurse, focused social worker or lead in a uniform group. 

 

Just because the welfare system is open to abuse, we should be putting more effort to ensure that any abuse is minimised and loop holes plugged so that more deserving individuals are not devoid of help. 

 

Just because self entitlement is set in stone from decades ago means we give up improving? I grew up fighting for everything I have achieved till now. Big part is, which I am grateful for is the support I have from my stay home mom, and a hardworking blue collar dad. Am I entitled to the fruits of my achievements? Maybe.... Am I grateful to my parents...of course! Do I grumble about the handouts (gst vouchers/utility rebates) the government gave out which always seem to exclude me... Hell yes..... Do I want to see my tax dollars better spent to help the real needy... Of course. 

 

Everyone knows that having less children and offering better quality care and higher financial resources per kid is good but if you sit down and ponder, not everyone is born to be a LKY, an engineer, lawyer or doctor.

It’s just like there are Merc, BMW, Toyota, Kia, and Geely, the roads can’t have only one type of vehicles.
We need Hiace, Vito and motorbikes to do the mundane but crucial work.

The country needs talents in every form and areas. We need more entrepreneurs and enterprising talents and it would appear many are born out of harsh backgrounds. We Dun need thousands of lawyers and bankers....... especially engineers. But we certainly require more people in industries that locals shun. Nurses, social workers, uniform services etc.

The welfare system is open to abuse. Which system is not?

The kids may be self entitled. Tell me which Singaporean is not? Self entitlement has already set in from a decade ago, kids from young all the way to pioneer citizens are mostly self entitled. This however is another topic altogether.

 

[Sosaria]

Unending argument because everyone is talking based on personal experience. Those who choose not to have kids, those who have one only, or the SG cookie-cutter default two, those who have three or more.

 

End of the day, nothing wrong with the guy having a large family, but personally feel he should've stopped at four max. Even five is already mind-boggling nowadays. Still have the joys of a large family, but the burden is at least more bearable compared to seven.

 

I think there's some underlying religious reason but he doesn't say it. Also wondering where/how the couple has time/energy/privacy to keep producing??

[Piyopico]

There lies in the fallacy of your argument in that having more resources being focused on the child means that he will have to be a LKY, engineer, lawyer or a doctor?

 

Don't assume that single child family will not produce an upright well adjusted member of the society who is going to contribute back to the society as dedicated nurse, focused social worker or lead in a uniform group.

 

Just because the welfare system is open to abuse, we should be putting more effort to ensure that any abuse is minimised and loop holes plugged so that more deserving individuals are not devoid of help.

 

Just because self entitlement is set in stone from decades ago means we give up improving? I grew up fighting for everything I have achieved till now. Big part is, which I am grateful for is the support I have from my stay home mom, and a hardworking blue collar dad. Am I entitled to the fruits of my achievements? Maybe.... Am I grateful to my parents...of course! Do I grumble about the handouts (gst vouchers/utility rebates) the government gave out which always seem to exclude me... Hell yes..... Do I want to see my tax dollars better spent to help the real needy... Of course.

I made no assumptions. I am only saying lots of single child are brought up badly. Having resources offer no guarantee. Of course single child can be successful and contribute to society. Likewise, having less resources does not mean a kid will not make it in life. In any case, making it in life is subjective.

 

Welfare system as we know now is flawed. I also hope it can be better and offer help to the right people.

 

Entitlement culture is deserving of another topic. Not gonna touch too much on this.

 

Just wanna touch on:

 

“But the line has to be drawn when your choice puts your children at a disadvantage that they did not asked to be born into and drawing upon public resources (tax money and welfare) that could have been better allocated to citizens who did not have a choice in their disadvantaged situation.”

 

These seven kids did not have a choice to be born into the very disadvantaged situation that you mentioned. How do you draw a line? Penalize the parents in ways like making them go for mastectomy etc so that there will be no 8th child? Counseling perhaps. Social worker assist in family budget etc.

However you cannot penalize the parents in a way that is indirectly taking away the very assistance and monetary help that each child requires. These 7 kids are the real needy. They are citizens and they are disadvantaged through no decision of their own.

 

Who are the people that we should single out? The rich who abuse the system?

Those who are pre diabetic and yet eat themselves to full blown diabetes etc. ?

We can improve the welfare system to weed out the rich lazy leaches but how about those who abuse themselves on sugary stuff, do drugs etc? They did put themselves in that disadvantaged position.

 

No easy decisions.

[Voodooman]

Everyone knows that having less children and offering better quality care and higher financial resources per kid is good but if you sit down and ponder, not everyone is born to be a LKY, an engineer, lawyer or doctor.

 

Itâs just like there are Merc, BMW, Toyota, Kia, and Geely, the roads canât have only one type of vehicles.

We need Hiace, Vito and motorbikes to do the mundane but crucial work.

 

The country needs talents in every form and areas. We need more entrepreneurs and enterprising talents and it would appear many are born out of harsh backgrounds. We Dun need thousands of lawyers and bankers....... especially engineers. But we certainly require more people in industries that locals shun. Nurses, social workers, uniform services etc.

 

The welfare system is open to abuse. Which system is not?

 

The kids may be self entitled. Tell me which Singaporean is not? Self entitlement has already set in from a decade ago, kids from young all the way to pioneer citizens are mostly self entitled. This however is another topic altogether.

A lot of entrepreneurs I know these days come from good background and are highly educated.

 

These days, it is about education, money and connection.

 

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/qz.com/455109/entrepreneurs-dont-have-a-special-gene-for-risk-they-come-from-families-with-money/amp/

[Piyopico]

A lot of entrepreneurs I know these days come from good background and are highly educated.

 

These days, it is about education, money and connection.

 

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/qz.com/455109/entrepreneurs-dont-have-a-special-gene-for-risk-they-come-from-families-with-money/amp/

Actually it has always been about education money and talent...... sorry I meant connection.

 

 

Edited July 8, 2018 by Piyopico

[Sdf4786k]

i on the other hand applaud the courage and tenacity of the couple to raise 7 children. Its their choice and while some might choose abortion as a solution, the couple did the greatest thing by bringing up the child.

 

Monetary and materialistic comfort is subjective.You can be not rich but still be happy.

 

wish they had easier access to Condom..

[Tianmo]

I think it is debatable on the subject of single child or multiple children family, but there will never be a conclusion because there will always be some cases of the opposite on both side, it will never be a one sided event. 

 

I also concur that we sld not be judgmental on how many children a family choose to have, provided they keep the decision to themselves. Once you choose to go public, do not expect only good will, encouragements and donations will start to pour in. If you decided to accept public help, be also be prepared for public negative feed backs. There is no such a thing as take only. 

 

apply for as many gov finance help scheme as possible, take whatever the gov can help you. That is a wise decision, but consider not twice but a few times before you think the public can help to finance your family. 

 

My thoughts are only pertaining to this family as a single case, not how many children any family choose to have. 

 

I read through the write up, the mother is not happy, the children are not happy, even the sole person who made all the decision is not happy. So in such a case here, who really is not rich and happy? 

 

Heng said he loves children, so he decided to have more, though his wife had originally planned for 2. Mine you, Children are not the same as toy collections, we have an obligation, commitment and responsibility to every single life we bring on for at least 21 years. Just because of your personal interest in loving children, you bring so many of them here to suffer, this is selfish.

 

Heng quite his job to start a business, without blessing or discussion with his wife, knowing very well their family situation. Again, another personal interest vs family interest, putting the family on great pressure, a very selfish move. 

 

7 kids and only 1 boy, is this a case of the thoughts of 不孝有三，无后为大？bring on the girls until you hit a boy? and then hope for another one, in the process producing afew more girls? 

 

Lets face it, its really not so easy to be a responsible father and a good father at the same time. Not unless you are farking rich and can stay home with the kids all day. Reminds me of the reply from Jackie Chan (成龙) when he was interviewed on fatherhood and his son some years back. His reply was he told his son, " 我可能没法看着你长大， 没法每天陪你入睡， 对你而言我或许不是一个好爸爸， 但是我是一个负责任的爸爸， 因为我必须去赚钱养家。"

 

They hardly have any savings, and now even in a deficit of $500 every month. Heng said while waiting for his business to take off, how long is he expecting that to be when he took that step? 

 

Mrs Heng said she cannot live without the washing machine, so base on current situation, what happens when the washing machine breaks down? Expect someone to donate them one? or walk into any shop and show them the  newspaper cutting, hoping for a free one? 

 

I mayb a very hard nut to crack, but I am not a heartless person, however I still try to look at facts and figures before i comment, of course I can only base on whatever information available at the point of comment. 

 

Purely on this case, my thought is, he ask for it. 

Edited July 8, 2018 by Tianmo

[Silver_blade]

Agree

[Lala81]

To me, my POV is that yes, me and my wife a bit shake head at the decision of the parents.

Like i said, the wife and the husband don't seem to have a plan B at all.

 

But ultimately, the children are citizens of singapore and they deserve all the welfare they are entitled to.

Whether the children secretly bemoan their circumstances or not, frankly we should not step into it. As it's a family affair.

 

I don't think whether being a single child or a child in a big family really matters much. U can't predict whether the child will get totally du lan with the parents when they reach pri/sec school, or become the world's most filial son/dg.

 

 

I think it is debatable on the subject of single child or multiple children family, but there will never be a conclusion because there will always be some cases of the opposite on both side, it will never be a one sided event. 

 

I also concur that we sld not be judgmental on how many children a family choose to have, provided they keep the decision to themselves. Once you choose to go public, do not expect only good will, encouragements and donations will start to pour in. If you decided to accept public help, be also be prepared for public negative feed backs. There is no such a thing as take only. 

 

apply for as many gov finance help scheme as possible, take whatever the gov can help you. That is a wise decision, but consider not twice but a few times before you think the public can help to finance your family. 

 

My thoughts are only pertaining to this family as a single case, not how many children any family choose to have. 

 

I read through the write up, the mother is not happy, the children are not happy, even the sole person who made all the decision is not happy. So in such a case here, who really is not rich and happy? 

 

Heng said he loves children, so he decided to have more, though his wife had originally planned for 2. Mine you, Children are not the same as toy collections, we have an obligation, commitment and responsibility to every single life we bring on for at least 21 years. Just because of your personal interest in loving children, you bring so many of them here to suffer, this is selfish.

 

Heng quite his job to start a business, without blessing or discussion with his wife, knowing very well their family situation. Again, another personal interest vs family interest, putting the family on great pressure, a very selfish move. 

 

7 kids and only 1 boy, is this a case of the thoughts of 不孝有三，无后为大？bring on the girls until you hit a boy? and then hope for another one, in the process producing afew more girls? 

 

Lets face it, its really not so easy to be a responsible father and a good father at the same time. Not unless you are farking rich and can stay home with the kids all day. Reminds me of the reply from Jackie Chan (成龙) when he was interviewed on fatherhood and his son some years back. His reply was he told his son, " 我可能没法看着你长大， 没法每天陪你入睡， 对你而言我或许不是一个好爸爸， 但是我是一个负责任的爸爸， 因为我必须去赚钱养家。"

 

They hardly have any savings, and now even in a deficit of $500 every month. Heng said while waiting for his business to take off, how long is he expecting that to be when he took that step? 

 

Mrs Heng said she cannot live without the washing machine, so base on current situation, what happens when the washing machine breaks down? Expect someone to donate them one? or walk into any shop and show them the  newspaper cutting, hoping for a free one? 

 

I mayb a very hard nut to crack, but I am not a heartless person, however I still try to look at facts and figures before i comment, of course I can only base on whatever information available at the point of comment. 

 

Purely on this case, my thought is, he ask for it. 

 

Whether you are a filial son/dg, also in my experience, doesn't totally tie in at all with being a productive member of society.

[Kopites]

I think it is debatable on the subject of single child or multiple children family, but there will never be a conclusion because there will always be some cases of the opposite on both side, it will never be a one sided event.

 

I also concur that we sld not be judgmental on how many children a family choose to have, provided they keep the decision to themselves. Once you choose to go public, do not expect only good will, encouragements and donations will start to pour in. If you decided to accept public help, be also be prepared for public negative feed backs. There is no such a thing as take only.

 

apply for as many gov finance help scheme as possible, take whatever the gov can help you. That is a wise decision, but consider not twice but a few times before you think the public can help to finance your family.

 

My thoughts are only pertaining to this family as a single case, not how many children any family choose to have.

 

I read through the write up, the mother is not happy, the children are not happy, even the sole person who made all the decision is not happy. So in such a case here, who really is not rich and happy?

 

Heng said he loves children, so he decided to have more, though his wife had originally planned for 2. Mine you, Children are not the same as toy collections, we have an obligation, commitment and responsibility to every single life we bring on for at least 21 years. Just because of your personal interest in loving children, you bring so many of them here to suffer, this is selfish.

 

Heng quite his job to start a business, without blessing or discussion with his wife, knowing very well their family situation. Again, another personal interest vs family interest, putting the family on great pressure, a very selfish move.

 

7 kids and only 1 boy, is this a case of the thoughts of ä¸å­æä¸ï¼æ å为大ï¼bring on the girls until you hit a boy? and then hope for another one, in the process producing afew more girls?

 

Lets face it, its really not so easy to be a responsible father and a good father at the same time. Not unless you are farking rich and can stay home with the kids all day. Reminds me of the reply from Jackie Chan (æé¾) when he was interviewed on fatherhood and his son some years back. His reply was he told his son, " æå¯è½æ²¡æ³ççä½ é¿å¤§ï¼ 没æ³æ¯å¤©éªä½ å¥ç¡ï¼ å¯¹ä½ èè¨ææ许ä¸æ¯ä¸ä¸ªå¥½ç¸ç¸ï¼ ä½æ¯ææ¯ä¸ä¸ªè´è´£ä»»çç¸ç¸ï¼ å 为æå¿é¡»å»èµé±å»å®¶ã"

 

They hardly have any savings, and now even in a deficit of $500 every month. Heng said while waiting for his business to take off, how long is he expecting that to be when he took that step?

 

Mrs Heng said she cannot live without the washing machine, so base on current situation, what happens when the washing machine breaks down? Expect someone to donate them one? or walk into any shop and show them the newspaper cutting, hoping for a free one?

 

I mayb a very hard nut to crack, but I am not a heartless person, however I still try to look at facts and figures before i comment, of course I can only base on whatever information available at the point of comment.

 

Purely on this case, my thought is, he ask for it.

fully agreed..

 

I am in mcf forum now. I go get my dream car Toyota altis default on payment and expect government to bail me out? I can go without a car same like he can't go without a washer.

 

someone state the elite or jlhigh ses draw the boundaries line. my view is we should draw our own line. 1/2/3...child's as long as we can't bring food to the table. You don't exprct welfare society to bring food onto your table.

 

$3000 per month shouldn't even be in the bracket of lower income group.

Edited July 8, 2018 by Kopites