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How to enforce the law for PMDS?


VteckiCk
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1 hour ago, Wind30 said:

I thought the video is daytime and this pic is nighttime...

stunned like a vegetable sit until night time 🤐

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orbigood for the criminal. 

i think if you are committing a crime and got spotted by enforcers, they have the right to stop you without using lethal force (aka gun shot). I remember a few years ago, there's a new about an anti vice use their car to ram into the drug trafficker's car just to stop him from escaping.  

If the criminal is having the intent to escape, there is no way the enforcers can safely and gently apprehend him, especially he is on a speeding PMD and they are on foot with no forms of protection against impact. A kick might be the best solution given the situation.  

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8 hours ago, Yewheng said:

The problem is PMD ride so fast, that's the only way to catch them. If not how? Run and chase the pmd? 

 

In anyway this officer is darn skillful.. Look at his kick and timing.. Not many people can do that. He must had practiced it countless of times just to catch these speeding pmd rider.. 

reminds me of this😂

giphy.gif

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29 minutes ago, Stratovarius said:

orbigood for the criminal. 

i think if you are committing a crime and got spotted by enforcers, they have the right to stop you without using lethal force (aka gun shot). I remember a few years ago, there's a new about an anti vice use their car to ram into the drug trafficker's car just to stop him from escaping.  

If the criminal is having the intent to escape, there is no way the enforcers can safely and gently apprehend him, especially he is on a speeding PMD and they are on foot with no forms of protection against impact. A kick might be the best solution given the situation.  

Ya lor.. If not put enforcement officer there for show only if they are not allowed to kick to catch them. 

 

Imagine let's say circular passed down to enforcement officer.. Do not kick these pmd rider when they are approaching.. Chase them and pull them over. So the enforcement officer listened to the instructions. So now same scenario happened.. PMD rider come speeding approaching the traffic junction, enforcement officer saw the pmd rider.. Quickly run towards the pmd rider.. However now, this enforcement officer did not kick him, coz not allowed to... Than what happen next? The enforcement officer just stop there use his hand to signal the pmd rider to stop.. Before he going to raise his hand fully to ask pmd rider to stop, the pmd rider would had already zoom pass the enforcement officer.. And then now the enforcement officer look like an idiot on the road.. Like as if station there for show only.. Can't do anything to catch pmd rider speeding on the road.. 

Edited by Yewheng
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1 hour ago, Galantspeedz said:

Maybe you saw a clearer video..  the video I saw only show the warden running out then the PMD appeared from behind the car which was on the 2nd lane

Also based on the article in straits time, what the PMD did is not under the purview of LTA enforcement officers but Traffic police

Not sure if it has been merged since I can't find anything on it

The rider should most likely be on the right side of the road then switch lane to the left side (which we then see him emerge from behind the car) 

Before that you don't see him anywhere on left side of the road next to kerb

Based on this alone, rider seems like taking the road as his playground

Either way, glad he is caught

Right or wrong leave it to lta to settle

Hope he is not too badly injured

Recover soon

Pay his dues and hopefully get off the road

As for the cisco officer, I can't say he is right or wrong too

He made a call to stop the rider there and then

He successfully did albeit quite dramatically (and skillfully too must admit) 

At the very least, I should say at least he stepped up, did his best and maybe more than he should to enforce the law

Whatever the outcome or punishment he may or may not face, best of luck

I'm sure at that point he didn't mean to harm the pmd rider but it was likely a split second decision

 

Edited by VteckiCk
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Latest news.. That enforcement officer is suspended.. 

https://stomp.straitstimes.com/singapore-seen/certis-cisco-officer-suspended-after-kicking-pmd-user-off-device-at-bedok-reservoir#xtor=CS9-78

 

Looks like in future a lot more pmd riders will be able to easily escape from being caught.. Due to they knew that enforcement officer are not allowed to use kick to kick them off the ride. Haiz.. 

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, Wind30 said:

you concerned for yourself or others? Do you intend to run from enforcement officer?

Nothing to be concerned about if you don't run... or better still don't break the law. 

anyway, I have stated my opinon. If that guy is running from the enforcement officers, he deserve it. If the enforcement officer was running towards the PMD rider and kicked the PMD without any prior warning, I think it is excessive. 

Don't think running away justified the use of excessive force. If that is the case, the police should have the right to pull their guns on a suspected criminal running away from a crime scene, whether it is a murderer (maybe) or a petty thief. 

Okok... An extreme example but the concept appears lost on many.  Use of force must be proportional to the crime and for safety of all. 

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In response to a Stomp query, the Singapore Civil Defence Force (SCDF) said that they received a call for assistance at the junction of Bedok Reservoir Road and Bedok Reservoir View at about 6.55pm.

"A man was taken to Changi General Hospital," an SCDF spokesman said.

A spokesman from Certis told Stomp that the rider suffered abrasions on his right elbow and right knee and received medical attention from paramedics at the scene.

The officer was also injured and treated at the scene before being taken to hospital for further medical assistance.

Here is Certis's official statement in full:

"On 10 December 2019 at 6.40pm, two Certis CISCO Auxiliary Police Officers were carrying out enforcement duties along Bedok Reservoir Road and Bedok Reservoir View.

"They encountered a Personal Mobility Device (PMD) user who endangered public safety by riding on the road at high speed.

"The rider ignored repeated instructions from the officers to stop as his actions could cause serious injuries to members of the public or himself.

"A Certis CISCO officer who was stationed at the next junction resorted to kicking his device when the rider refused to stop.

"The rider suffered abrasions on his right elbow and right knee and received medical attention from paramedics at the scene.

"The officer was also injured, and was treated at the site before heading to the hospital for further medical assistance.

"Established enforcement protocols require officers to note down the appearance of the escaping PMD user as accurately as possible, and lodge a report with LTA.

Certis has a zero-tolerance policy against rash acts and will not hesitate to take stern action against officers who are found to be in breach of protocol.

"A disciplinary inquiry will be conducted for this incident, and we are providing full assistance to the Police in their investigation.

"The officer has been suspended from active duties."

The Land Transport Authority (LTA) told Stomp it is looking into the matter.

The police are investigating the incident.

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12 minutes ago, Voodooman said:

Don't think running away justified the use of excessive force. If that is the case, the police should have the right to pull their guns on a suspected criminal running away from a crime scene, whether it is a murderer (maybe) or a petty thief. 

Okok... An extreme example but the concept appears lost on many.  Use of force must be proportional to the crime and for safety of all. 

Disagree.  It's not the same.

Anyway we will have to agree to disagree.  I can only predict two things from here.

1)  PMD riders will be more bold from now on.

2)  Security guards/personnel like condo guards and Cisco will be less passionate on their duties and just to the bare minimum.  This will only be to the detriment of society.

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27 minutes ago, Yewheng said:

Latest news.. That enforcement officer is suspended.. 

https://stomp.straitstimes.com/singapore-seen/certis-cisco-officer-suspended-after-kicking-pmd-user-off-device-at-bedok-reservoir#xtor=CS9-78

 

Looks like in future a lot more pmd riders will be able to easily escape from being caught.. Due to they knew that enforcement officer are not allowed to use kick to kick them off the ride. Haiz.. 

 

 

 

Poor Cisco Officer,trying to get Rid of these PMD ''Pest'' got Suspended....😭

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32 minutes ago, VteckiCk said:

In response to a Stomp query, the Singapore Civil Defence Force (SCDF) said that they received a call for assistance at the junction of Bedok Reservoir Road and Bedok Reservoir View at about 6.55pm.

"A man was taken to Changi General Hospital," an SCDF spokesman said.

A spokesman from Certis told Stomp that the rider suffered abrasions on his right elbow and right knee and received medical attention from paramedics at the scene.

The officer was also injured and treated at the scene before being taken to hospital for further medical assistance.

Here is Certis's official statement in full:

"On 10 December 2019 at 6.40pm, two Certis CISCO Auxiliary Police Officers were carrying out enforcement duties along Bedok Reservoir Road and Bedok Reservoir View.

"They encountered a Personal Mobility Device (PMD) user who endangered public safety by riding on the road at high speed.

"The rider ignored repeated instructions from the officers to stop as his actions could cause serious injuries to members of the public or himself.

"A Certis CISCO officer who was stationed at the next junction resorted to kicking his device when the rider refused to stop.

"The rider suffered abrasions on his right elbow and right knee and received medical attention from paramedics at the scene.

"The officer was also injured, and was treated at the site before heading to the hospital for further medical assistance.

"Established enforcement protocols require officers to note down the appearance of the escaping PMD user as accurately as possible, and lodge a report with LTA.

Certis has a zero-tolerance policy against rash acts and will not hesitate to take stern action against officers who are found to be in breach of protocol.

"A disciplinary inquiry will be conducted for this incident, and we are providing full assistance to the Police in their investigation.

"The officer has been suspended from active duties."

The Land Transport Authority (LTA) told Stomp it is looking into the matter.

The police are investigating the incident.

This article provided 2 answers to all the past postings:

1. That errant PMD rider was indeed riding recklessly on the road, endangering others and trying to get away from the Cisco Officers despite been instructed to stop repeatedly. Clear cut violations to Road Traffic Act and/or Active Mobility Act.

2. The action by that Cisco officer has violated Cisco enforcement protocol and policy, thus he got suspended, nothing to do with LTA or Police at the moment. Fair, since company policy always come first.

So I guess all PMD users are now grinning, as nothing could have stopped them literally, and whoever follow enforcement officers instructions (stopping and allowing personal particular to be recorded) are bo ji / kam gong / gong Kia / kia si / bo nao / tao nao pai, etc. etc. 

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6 minutes ago, Carbon82 said:

This article provided 2 answers to all the past postings:

1. That errant PMD rider was indeed riding recklessly on the road, endangering others and trying to get away from the Cisco Officers despite been instructed to stop repeatedly. Clear cut violations to Road Traffic Act and/or Active Mobility Act.

2. The action by that Cisco officer has violated Cisco enforcement protocol and policy, thus he got suspended, nothing to do with LTA or Police at the moment. Fair, since company policy always come first.

So I guess all PMD users are now grinning, as nothing could have stopped them literally, and whoever follow enforcement officers instructions (stopping and allowing personal particular to be recorded) are bo ji / kam gong / gong Kia / kia si / bo nao / tao nao pai, etc. etc. 

Ya lor.. Like as if discribe as accurately as possible can help catch that pmd rider later on. Most likely they would had excape and continue to ride pmd on the road...

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6 hours ago, Galantspeedz said:

i can't see how running across the road with the intention to stop the offender is deem instinctive.

I think the correct word should be premediated

It is instinctive for me, premeditative as you prefer, OK? 

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3 minutes ago, RadX said:

I can see the pmd  smiling away w this precedent action

It'll make enforcement more difficult.. they know enforcement can't do anything other than yelling or chasing after the PMD on foot, and nothing else. More will take the chance to escape.

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13 minutes ago, Yewheng said:

Ya lor.. Like as if discribe as accurately as possible can help catch that pmd rider later on. Most likely they would had excape and continue to ride pmd on the road...

Lol.  I imagine this.  One PMD rider weave in and out of traffic.  Cause accidents.  CISCO officer give description to TP

"I saw someone riding a PMD.  Looks like a man of average size.  White shirt black pants. No photo or license plate."

See how the TP track him down. 

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41 minutes ago, Philipkee said:

Disagree.  It's not the same.

Anyway we will have to agree to disagree.  I can only predict two things from here.

1)  PMD riders will be more bold from now on.

2)  Security guards/personnel like condo guards and Cisco will be less passionate on their duties and just to the bare minimum.  This will only be to the detriment of society.

10 years later, when we looked back at the PMD issue, we will perhaps laugh at it but the long term impact of a society condoning and encouraging excessive use of force would be far more serious. 

We can agree to disagree. 

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