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Pritam Singh asked Chan Chun Sing whether is PAP releasing the amount of jobs between locals and foreigners


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14 hours ago, Wind30 said:

Lets say the government gives you the data.... and the data shows 60% of these PRs go away after X number of years. Is that going to help you or Singapore?

you are pointing out the problems which are serious and valid ones.  so what are the alternatives? what do you expect the government to do?

My solution is what many have already mentioned: Education. And I mean starting to train local graduate the skill set needed when EDB map out the economic master plan for the next 5 - 10 years.

Quote you an life example I have seen for myself. I used to work in an aerospace firm, and my understanding is that our government have started mooting the idea of establishing an aerospace park back in early 2006. But when the first few aerospace firms started their operation at the new Seletar Aerospace Park in 2011/ 2012, there isn't any many local technical expertise in this field, and our government then started to get ITE, Polytechnic and University to offer relevant courses to back fill the gap.

 

Taken this example from Philip Yeo's Neither Civil nor Servant:

Let me tell you a story. When Lee Kuan Yew was in charge, he called me to Istana one day. He was still Prime Minister and I was EDB chairman. I sat down. It was just the two of us.

“Can you bring investments to Woodlands?” he asked me.

“Can you put an MRT station there?” I replied.

Finished. I walked out. Our conversation lasted less than a minute. I knew he called the Minister of Communications right away and said that Woodlands must get an MRT station. I quickly got TECH (Texas Instruments, EDB, Canon and Hewlett-Packard – Semiconductors) to get set up in Woodlands, way before the MRT station was even up. I pushed for projects to go to Woodlands. I didn’t write a memo. I didn’t have to answer him on how we were going to do it. He took my word and I took his word. He wanted something and I delivered.

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On 1/6/2020 at 10:32 PM, Windwaver said:

I saw the video.

I kind of like Chan Chun Sing but quite obviously (from his reaction) releasing the figures will affect election votes :beaten:

I would like to state that by being frank, straightforward, and direct to the point. Even if the figures is unfavourable toward the current mainstream party, it will allow others to present viable, alternative and reasonable solutions to debate and work out any solution that will solve the problem. Whether it is making amendment to the current immigration policy or whether we need to make certain amendment to population growth policy, I think it is fair for anyone who is rightfully elected by the people to ask reasonable and valid question in order to address any mistake whoever might have made in the past. 

Edited by Dinosaur33
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18 hours ago, inlinesix said:

In Singapore, you are NOT an expert if you are not paid in millions.

That's why the ministar will tell you MAI KAY POH.

At the most, we will let the people decide who is the expert on the ground. 

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2 hours ago, Dinosaur33 said:

I would like to state that by being frank, straightforward, and direct to the point. Even if the figures is unfavourable toward the current mainstream party, it will allow others to present viable, alternative and reasonable solutions to debate and work out any solution that will solve the problem. Whether it is making amendment to the current immigration policy or whether we need to make certain amendment to population growth policy, I think it is fair for anyone who is rightfully elected by the people to ask reasonable and valid question in order to address any mistake whoever might have made in the past. 

I was there... 3000 years ago...

 

People asked,  something's wrong with the immigration policy... 

Trains packed like sardine. 

Medical cost through the roof.

Patients sleeping in tents. 

Housing cost fxxking bonkers and wrecked many people. 

University places all FT .. (remember current yearly $238m is only 50%)

What was their reply???

Took about 15 years to fix... 15 long years of opportunity cost... now... dejavou..

2ddy1a.jpg

image.png.9da3e9238a899b0aae717a8cb6df7d52.png

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On 1/16/2020 at 8:48 AM, Wind30 said:

Lets say the government gives you the data.... and the data shows 60% of these PRs go away after X number of years. Is that going to help you or Singapore?

you are pointing out the problems which are serious and valid ones.  so what are the alternatives? what do you expect the government to do?

 

 

For the government to be honest with us and themselves. Not to hide behind manipulated analysis. Face the problem and reform policies that are wrong. 

For us to decide if the government is doing enough to keep them in position during the next GE. 

I feel they are more worried about the latter. 

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This saga shows one point. The current government are not as confident as the previous generation. They know the problem and try to spin the info as something not too bad. They know it is going to look bad on them if they release and does not have a solution for the inherent problem. 

When pushed, they panicked and throw tantrums with response like "what's the point of the question."

What Pritam raised was logical and reasonable and is a question that every local Singaporeans have on their minds whenever data like that are being presented.

As much as up to this point, I pretty much like the second generation leaders, I do feel they lack the ability to handle some tricky situations. 

Why I support WP is not because they have solid leadership and plans for Singapore but rather they have been asking the right questions on behalf of Singaporean in Parliament. WP's MPs response to some of the rebuttal have firm and professional which gives me the confident that they will stand up for Singaporean.

 

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9 hours ago, Carbon82 said:

My solution is what many have already mentioned: Education. And I mean starting to train local graduate the skill set needed when EDB map out the economic master plan for the next 5 - 10 years.

Quote you an life example I have seen for myself. I used to work in an aerospace firm, and my understanding is that our government have started mooting the idea of establishing an aerospace park back in early 2006. But when the first few aerospace firms started their operation at the new Seletar Aerospace Park in 2011/ 2012, there isn't any many local technical expertise in this field, and our government then started to get ITE, Polytechnic and University to offer relevant courses to back fill the gap.

 

Taken this example from Philip Yeo's Neither Civil nor Servant:

Let me tell you a story. When Lee Kuan Yew was in charge, he called me to Istana one day. He was still Prime Minister and I was EDB chairman. I sat down. It was just the two of us.

“Can you bring investments to Woodlands?” he asked me.

“Can you put an MRT station there?” I replied.

Finished. I walked out. Our conversation lasted less than a minute. I knew he called the Minister of Communications right away and said that Woodlands must get an MRT station. I quickly got TECH (Texas Instruments, EDB, Canon and Hewlett-Packard – Semiconductors) to get set up in Woodlands, way before the MRT station was even up. I pushed for projects to go to Woodlands. I didn’t write a memo. I didn’t have to answer him on how we were going to do it. He took my word and I took his word. He wanted something and I delivered.

When Lee Kuan Yew was in charge

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6 minutes ago, Gizmore said:

This saga shows one point. The current government are not as confident as the previous generation. They know the problem and try to spin the info as something not too bad. They know it is going to look bad on them if they release and does not have a solution for the inherent problem. 

When pushed, they panicked and throw tantrums with response like "what's the point of the question."

What Pritam raised was logical and reasonable and is a question that every local Singaporeans have on their minds whenever data like that are being presented.

As much as up to this point, I pretty much like the second generation leaders, I do feel they lack the ability to handle some tricky situations. 

Why I support WP is not because they have solid leadership and plans for Singapore but rather they have been asking the right questions on behalf of Singaporean in Parliament. WP's MPs response to some of the rebuttal have firm and professional which gives me the confident that they will stand up for Singaporean.

 


so the data is there. Now what??? As I said I am curious Like ccs what’s the point of getting those data.

people never watch the video. Ccs never said he is not going to give data. Right up front, he said we can get you the data before asking what’s the point. Sometimes online people just never bother to even hear the context.... 

Edited by Wind30
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8 minutes ago, Gizmore said:

This saga shows one point. The current government are not as confident as the previous generation.d.

 

ccs wont even qualify to be there if he is not in PAP .

Edited by Beregond
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12 hours ago, Ash2017 said:

Bro 

I understand my opponent's situation and position.

You see even though I dislike writing this I must be fair.

Pritam is an opposition MP. He is suppose to bring any questions that his residents ask to parliament, even if just 1 resident ask.

From here, in MCF, many wants to know the breakdown, this is their right but that right does not mean the government necessarily need to provide as there are many sensitive reasons.

 

The above is obviously not true. Parliament time is really small. Pritam has to choose the most impt questions to ask... sure one, I expect out if 100 questions asked by Tom Dick Harry, he only have time for 1....

Therefore I really think the point of the question is Important...

i am not going to criticise without providing a better alternative (questions you ask)
if I am Pritam, the data I ask will be the employment numbers of local born Singaporeans, the salary distribution of local born Singaporeans, the cost of living, housing, medical. U need to restrict the data set to local born Singaporeans so that the data is not corrupted by new citizens, etc.
these data I feel is crucial in finding out, on the whole , has our strategy worked. Does it matter if ft gets paid more if the lives of Singaporeans as improved significantly??

thus I really feel wp direction of questioning is wrong. Sdp current investigation is better I feel. 
 

Edited by Wind30
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24 minutes ago, Gizmore said:

This saga shows one point. The current government are not as confident as the previous generation. They know the problem and try to spin the info as something not too bad. They know it is going to look bad on them if they release and does not have a solution for the inherent problem.

To be fair.. the previous gen also had their problems la... difference being. 

No internet then,  we won't even know what to ask. 

They will literally lock you up or ignore you.. no need pretend to legitimise bulls**t with pofma.

 

But In no way am I saying lhl reign is anyway better. 

 

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10 hours ago, Carbon82 said:

My solution is what many have already mentioned: Education. And I mean starting to train local graduate the skill set needed when EDB map out the economic master plan for the next 5 - 10 years.

Quote you an life example I have seen for myself. I used to work in an aerospace firm, and my understanding is that our government have started mooting the idea of establishing an aerospace park back in early 2006. But when the first few aerospace firms started their operation at the new Seletar Aerospace Park in 2011/ 2012, there isn't any many local technical expertise in this field, and our government then started to get ITE, Polytechnic and University to offer relevant courses to back fill the gap.

 

Taken this example from Philip Yeo's Neither Civil nor Servant:

Let me tell you a story. When Lee Kuan Yew was in charge, he called me to Istana one day. He was still Prime Minister and I was EDB chairman. I sat down. It was just the two of us.

“Can you bring investments to Woodlands?” he asked me.

“Can you put an MRT station there?” I replied.

Finished. I walked out. Our conversation lasted less than a minute. I knew he called the Minister of Communications right away and said that Woodlands must get an MRT station. I quickly got TECH (Texas Instruments, EDB, Canon and Hewlett-Packard – Semiconductors) to get set up in Woodlands, way before the MRT station was even up. I pushed for projects to go to Woodlands. I didn’t write a memo. I didn’t have to answer him on how we were going to do it. He took my word and I took his word. He wanted something and I delivered.

thats a different equation.

Now is if the pool of Singaporean is shirking and the need for more resources is required, do you still bang on what you have or take the easy way out. ?

From what we have seen so far, it all boils down to the tinted effect.

Its okey to have the talent from upton uni center to be a VP, but the unhappiness of a VP from ITE will create a uproar amongst the NTU, NUS grads ?

Imagine the many years of skill training and study been given a virtual slap in the face.

So its far far easier to take an external candidate to fill the role.

But base on the presentation of what was given, as long as you upgrade and get certified , you "will" be employable is a huge misrepresentation. But if you change it to "may be " its going to lack the interest in upskilling.

I know for a fact, that even if you have all the tick in the box, it boils down to manipulation in some sectors as well as bias on the singaporean workforce.

  

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28 minutes ago, Beregond said:

ccs wont even qualify to be there if he is not in PAP .

I think the problem is much worst than that. 

If the pap really got the depth of talent,  even CCS is in pap, ... no... the question is WHY they would bother asking him and those generals in tbe first place.??

During the Wikileaks.. Iirc , one of the pap said pap was scrapping the bottom of the barrel in new candidates. 

That they keep bringing in the generals shows a shift to loyalty instead of talent. 

Not to mention,  victor lye, chee hong tat, 500k is no dignity... realllyyyyy.. Singapore no talent or we are seeing talent avoiding them like the plague..

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59 minutes ago, Vratenza said:

For the government to be honest with us and themselves. Not to hide behind manipulated analysis. Face the problem and reform policies that are wrong. 

For us to decide if the government is doing enough to keep them in position during the next GE. 

I feel they are more worried about the latter. 

They could always do a steve jobs reply.

I don't really care about being right, I just care about success. I don't mind being wrong, and I'll admit that I'm wrong a lot. It doesn't really matter to me too much. What matters to me is that we do the right thing.

Steve Jobs

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15 hours ago, Wind30 said:

Seriously 80% went to Singaporeans??? Not in my industry... they must have included all the grab Drivers.... 

did they say it was PMETs? 

What about nursing?  We are professional also.  But never figured out if we are one of the PMETs 

 

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