sibor is getting phased out!

[Lala81]

4 minutes ago, Voodooman said:

Standard chartered too. I remember.

i dunno. i only paid home loans for <6 years. My board rate was amended few years within my loan. Though historically that board rate was stable for the last 10 years before that. Lol

[Enye]

2 minutes ago, Voodooman said:

 

Think I might have to downgrade to smaller HDB soon.  

wah boss... better not

firstly your atas powerful luxury car would look out of place in hdb mscp

secondly we peasants don’t wanna read about another million dollar hdb transacted in cash

😅🤣

[Throttle2]

43 minutes ago, Voodooman said:

Fixed is more difficult to amend. Max is 3 years but at least you have a real contract that is locked in.  You are paying for something.

All my mortgage loans in the past, all fixed rate.  No fret. 

Never really refinanced either.

becos paid up loan within the fixed rate period.   Wahahahahahaha

song doh hor, win or lose a few thousand here and there, makes no diff.

Edited August 1, 2020 by Throttle2

[Wind30]

17 minutes ago, Lala81 said:

The local banks may not do it easily. But Citi certainly did it in 2015. 

Your definition of recent covers 2015?

 

 

Yes that is recent. That is my point. When one bank does it, consumers can make them pay by switching to other banks. when all the banks do it together....
 

My first mortgage in 2001 was with Citibank... my subsequent ones are all with Ocbc. 

[Lala81]

13 minutes ago, Voodooman said:

Cimb tried.

Banks need to pay staff salary and shareholders, it is the amount of pain they can stomach. But i don't see them doing anything now that will be seen by G as unsympathetic.

You don't look like you are overstretched on property and your industry is doing well, why are you so worried?  By 2023, even without Sora, your bank will reprice your sibor loan if sibor stays at current level. It is just not sustainable. Anyway, in 3 years time, the interest rate environment might be very different. 

He's not worried. He's just buay song. 
Cos the other side has the audacity to change the parameters. Which isn't even within their control cos it's mostly MAS driven 

[Lala81]

1 minute ago, Wind30 said:

Yes that is recent. That is my point. When one bank does it, consumers can make them pay by switching to other banks. when all the banks do it together....
 

My first mortgage in 2001 was with Citibank... my subsequent ones are all with Ocbc. 

as the others said, What's in the future in 2024 no one knows lah. Just go with the flow lor.

 

[inlinesix]

1 minute ago, Lala81 said:

He's not worried. He's just buay song. 
Cos the other side has the audacity to change the parameters. Which isn't even within their control cos it's mostly MAS driven 

I bet Jacqueline will sent MAS receptionist to respond to him via phone.

[Alfc]

1 hour ago, inlinesix said:

A lot of ppl moves out of HDB loan as it is cheaper outside.

It is not a total loss cause for HDB loan takers.

While the rates are not commercially competitive, 1 of the better plus i find is it allows for loan repayment anytime, minimum i think is $5k, zero admin fee or lawyer or bank charge, and unlimited number of times. It goes to reducing the loan tenure while maintaining the monthly instalment amount. So still good for those who have saved up something, could not find better investment than 2.6%, or got extra bonus / windfall to pay off etc.

[Wind30]

26 minutes ago, Voodooman said:

Cimb tried.

Banks need to pay staff salary and shareholders, it is the amount of pain they can stomach. But i don't see them doing anything now that will be seen by G as unsympathetic.

You don't look like you are overstretched on property and your industry is doing well, why are you so worried?  By 2023, even without Sora, your bank will reprice your sibor loan if sibor stays at current level. It is just not sustainable. Anyway, in 3 years time, the interest rate environment might be very different. 

ya lar, I not showster, I only buy new property when I am almost finished with paying off my previous loan. 

like lala81 said, I am buaysong and find it unfair. Mas should be doing something to control the spread for old loans when sibor switch to SORA. It should not be let banks dictate whatever spread to give consumers... I just find it is err.... an injustice to consumers.

but after starting this thread, I am surprised the majority don’t feel this way... maybe I am wired different...

Edited August 1, 2020 by Wind30

[Enye]

5 minutes ago, Wind30 said:

ya lar, I not showster, I only buy new property when I am almost finished with paying off my previous loan. 

like lala81 said, I am buaysong and find it unfair. Mas should be doing something to control the spread for old loans when sibor switch to SORA. It should not be let banks dictate whatever spread to give consumers... I just find it is err.... an injustice to consumers.

but after starting this thread, I am surprised the majority don’t feel this way... maybe I am wired different...

who is the majority you speak of?

people who own > 1 property and have more than 1 property loan. that is the minority unfortunately.  

the majority is peasants living in hdb slums taking hdb loans and not involved in the property investment thingy.

but if you want to play in the big ocean, it’s ok.  just don’t be the small fry that gets eaten by big fishes when the environment changes

😬😅

[Throttle2]

18 minutes ago, Wind30 said:

ya lar, I not showster, I only buy new property when I am almost finished with paying off my previous loan. 

like lala81 said, I am buaysong and find it unfair. Mas should be doing something to control the spread for old loans when sibor switch to SORA. It should not be let banks dictate whatever spread to give consumers... I just find it is err.... an injustice to consumers.

but after starting this thread, I am surprised the majority don’t feel this way... maybe I am wired different...

Oh, you ARE wired differently, thats for sure.

 

[Throttle2]

9 minutes ago, Enye said:

who is the majority you speak of?

people who own > 1 property and have more than 1 property loan. that is the minority unfortunately.  

the majority is peasants living in hdb slums taking hdb loans and not involved in the property investment thingy.

but if you want to play in the big ocean, it’s ok.  just don’t be the small fry that gets eaten by big fishes when the environment changes

😬😅

Wah, dont remind me that i am a peasant ok? 

Let me live in my wildest TPS dreams , can or not.  😠

[Lightbringer]

7 hours ago, Wind30 said:

ya lar, I not showster, I only buy new property when I am almost finished with paying off my previous loan. 

like lala81 said, I am buaysong and find it unfair. Mas should be doing something to control the spread for old loans when sibor switch to SORA. It should not be let banks dictate whatever spread to give consumers... I just find it is err.... an injustice to consumers.

but after starting this thread, I am surprised the majority don’t feel this way... maybe I am wired different...

I agree with you. While the banks always have the right to reprice their loans due to the universally-found review clause in all mortgage contracts, strong competition in the finance market would make one player (or a cartel) strongly weigh the risks of losing market share against the costs (or lower profits) of not doing so. That is what healthy competition is meant to foster in any markets. Why should MAS give the banks a free pass to effectively reprice their loans without facing the consequences which would naturally arise from a competitive market? Those who harp on the universal clause , that SORA is effectively similar to SIBOR or any interbank indexes in nature, or whether banks owe consumers an obligation are missing the forest for the trees.

Let the banks reprice their loans AFTER the rollover to SORA if they wish to do so. MAS should institute a ceiling on the effective interest rates for the floating rate loans pegged to SIBOR after the rollover the SORA to ensure the EIR does not significantly increase. After the cooling period, banks can then start invoking the review clauses to reprice their loans. This is the most equitable execution of a new policy which would protect consumers rights as well as prevent the erosion of fair competition in the marketplace. There will definitely be a few institutions which would be more than willing to stomach their lower or "unsustainable" margins in order to gobble up market share in the aftermath. Consumers affected  by the review would refinance to these lower packages. If these packages prove to be unsustainable, then these same banks have the right to review and reprice their loan again, and the cycle starts afresh. That is how competitive markets work FOR THE INTEREST OF CONSUMERS. 

And for the gongkias who claim they are happy to pay higher interest rates because they want to support banks in tough times - I suggest you donate the differential interest rate to charities where your largess would make more impact to society at large instead.

[Lightbringer]

7 hours ago, Wind30 said:

ya lar, I not showster, I only buy new property when I am almost finished with paying off my previous loan. 

like lala81 said, I am buaysong and find it unfair. Mas should be doing something to control the spread for old loans when sibor switch to SORA. It should not be let banks dictate whatever spread to give consumers... I just find it is err.... an injustice to consumers.

but after starting this thread, I am surprised the majority don’t feel this way... maybe I am wired different...

I suspect many don't feel the way because they are using this thread to humblebrag and showboat about how market-savvy they are, and how interest rates swings doesn't affects them because aiya a few thousands here and a few thousands there doesn't matter right?

I'm pretty sure MAS is weighing the anti-competitive aspects of their policy execution right now. You could also consider writing in to the Competition Commisison of Singapore to see if they have a view on this (although I'm sure MAS would be consulting them given the widespread implications of this move down the road).

[Showster]

2 hours ago, Lightbringer said:

I agree with you. While the banks always have the right to reprice their loans due to the universally-found review clause in all mortgage contracts, strong competition in the finance market would make one player (or a cartel) strongly weigh the risks of losing market share against the costs (or lower profits) of not doing so. That is what healthy competition is meant to foster in any markets. Why should MAS give the banks a free pass to effectively reprice their loans without facing the consequences which would naturally arise from a competitive market? Those who harp on the universal clause , that SORA is effectively similar to SIBOR or any interbank indexes in nature, or whether banks owe consumers an obligation are missing the forest for the trees.

Let the banks reprice their loans AFTER the rollover to SORA if they wish to do so. MAS should institute a ceiling on the effective interest rates for the floating rate loans pegged to SIBOR after the rollover the SORA to ensure the EIR does not significantly increase. After the cooling period, banks can then start invoking the review clauses to reprice their loans. This is the most equitable execution of a new policy which would protect consumers rights as well as prevent the erosion of fair competition in the marketplace. There will definitely be a few institutions which would be more than willing to stomach their lower or "unsustainable" margins in order to gobble up market share in the aftermath. Consumers affected  by the review would refinance to these lower packages. If these packages prove to be unsustainable, then these same banks have the right to review and reprice their loan again, and the cycle starts afresh. That is how competitive markets work FOR THE INTEREST OF CONSUMERS. 

And for the gongkias who claim they are happy to pay higher interest rates because they want to support banks in tough times - I suggest you donate the differential interest rate to charities where your largess would make more impact to society at large instead.

Thanks for coming back online bro.

Yes, I will be happy to support any “rights” efforts.

Heavens have been extremely kind to me already, I will try to do whatever I can for charities as well.

All my moves have enabled me to pay an ultra low interest rate. Average 10 year rate maybe about 1.2%.

[Showster]

21 hours ago, Wind30 said:

ya lar, I not showster, I only buy new property when I am almost finished with paying off my previous loan. 

like lala81 said, I am buaysong and find it unfair. Mas should be doing something to control the spread for old loans when sibor switch to SORA. It should not be let banks dictate whatever spread to give consumers... I just find it is err.... an injustice to consumers.

but after starting this thread, I am surprised the majority don’t feel this way... maybe I am wired different...

I had to make the move early due to ABSD reason.

The permutation to play with... 

Will have to measure the weight of the ABSD (residential) against commercial / industrial (no ABSD) for the last move.

[Voodooman]

13 hours ago, Showster said:

Thanks for coming back online bro.

Yes, I will be happy to support any “rights” efforts.

Heavens have been extremely kind to me already, I will try to do whatever I can for charities as well.

All my moves have enabled me to pay an ultra low interest rate. Average 10 year rate maybe about 1.2%.

 

[Throttle2]

For those “property investors” people who have to start pressing buttons, wiping foreheads, pacing up and down over a couple of thousand dollars stretched across a period of time long enough for a seed to become a plant, i say go review your life.

you probably keep the clear stickers of your Rolex on while wearing it as well, yeah?  

🤦‍♂️
 

good luck. Huat ah

Edited August 2, 2020 by Throttle2