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China's mass surveillance of the world for secrets and scandal


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8 minutes ago, Thaiyotakamli said:

Choose freedom sure good

 

choose china only when u go online shopping 😁

Show some love for Amazon please 😂

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8 minutes ago, Vinyl said:

No, no. Some folks here don't care about what happens outside this region. They don't make judgements about regime change, war crimes, refugees crisis outside this region.

They think that US will never turn our region into a warzone because they feel so safe under the warm embracement of the US military.

As for debt trap diplomacy, here's an article stating some facts and not possibilities:

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2021/02/china-debt-trap-diplomacy/617953/

i think the west realize the china way of dealing with 3rd world country is working, and they trying to follow.

u alway see such comment in youtube and u know the truth.

'China uses dialogue and construction projects, the USA uses sanctions and bombs'

I read mixed feelings about China influence in Africa, some say, it is good and some say there is a hidden agenda, let me put it this way, only African people know whether it is genuine aids or not because for the last 50 years, the West is trying to help them in infrastructures but no physical structures become reality instead there were civil wars and destabilized governments because of their wealth being robbed. Now Chinese government are sending engineers, educators, farmers to teach them how to improve their country not soldiers and weapons. China are building highways, hydroelectric dams, highspeed railroad trains.

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2 minutes ago, Beregond said:

i think the west realize the china way of dealing with 3rd world country is working, and they trying to follow.

 u alway see such comment in youtube and u know the truth.

 'China uses dialogue and construction projects, the USA uses sanctions and bombs'

 I read mixed feelings about China influence in Africa, some say, it is good and some say there is a hidden agenda, let me put it this way, only African people know whether it is genuine aids or not because for the last 50 years, the West is trying to help them in infrastructures but no physical structures become reality instead there were civil wars and destabilized governments because of their wealth being robbed. Now Chinese government are sending engineers, educators, farmers to teach them how to improve their country not soldiers and weapons. China are building highways, hydroelectric dams, highspeed railroad trains.

There will always be skeptics about China's intentions but I'm sure you would prefer to see them competing with China in building infrastructures than being just sour, skeptical and creating doubts.

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(edited)
8 minutes ago, Vinyl said:

There will always be skeptics about China's intentions but I'm sure you would prefer to see them competing with China in building infrastructures than being just sour, skeptical and creating doubts.

actually china intention is the same as the west. they are after global dominance. they want the cheap labour ,the resources in africa. like congo.

but their method is different from the west.

west enter africa first, they also after the mines, they bring soldiers and make the ppl slaves. look at africa now, its obvious to say the democracy and freedom they bring there is not working.

now china enter, they bring  engineers, educators, farmers . true enough, they got the mines and resources and they intented to. but africans life also improve alot as a result. despite the debt, they got more infrastructures builded then ever.

i not saying its all good. as alway there are corruption and such stuff. but compare to what the west done with africa. which is better??

Edited by Beregond
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27 minutes ago, Vinyl said:

There will always be skeptics about China's intentions but I'm sure you would prefer to see them competing with China in building infrastructures than being just sour, skeptical and creating doubts.

i saw a youtube vid about african guy discuss the china aid. he sounded more anti-china but yet on paper he say the europeans cannot beat the chinese in cost.

attach it here in case anyone want to view. 

I think the africans should learn how to develop sustainably and make us of china's ability to teach and build for them cheaply. europeans are too costly and they wont send more than a handful of people over.

 

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28 minutes ago, Beregond said:

actually china intention is the same as the west. they are after global dominance. they want the cheap labour ,the resources in africa. like congo.

but their method is different from the west.

west enter africa first, they also after the mines, they bring soldiers and make the ppl slaves. look at africa now, its obvious to say the democracy and freedom they bring there is not working.

now china enter, they bring  engineers, educators, farmers . true enough, they got the mines and resources and they intented to. but africans life also improve alot as a result. despite the debt, they got more infrastructures builded then ever.

i not saying its all good. as alway there are corruption and such stuff. but compare to what the west done with africa. which is better??

in geopolitics, it is not good enough looking at china or the us effect on just asean. 

always look at long historic perspective, globally like africa, latin america, ME, east asia.

what happens in 1 region may very well visit another region

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1 hour ago, Thaiyotakamli said:

Choose freedom sure good

 

choose china only when u go online shopping 😁

I choose taobao + amazon. 

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(edited)

Aiyah in the end, I choose a stable China and stable America. 

The more domestic instability they suffer, the more likely a bogeyman, nationalistic stuff will fall onto us in SEA. 

You can argue if they are unstable or have rising domestic tensions, then they will turn inward. But I think its more likely some war or punitive crap will happen to their spheres of influence. 

 

Edited by Lala81
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Everything sound good until someone said besides the debt.

:D

As of 2020, the countries in Africa with the largest Chinese debt are Angola ($25 billion), Ethiopia ($13.5 billion), Zambia ($7.4 billion), the Republic of Congo ($7.3 billion), and Sudan ($6.4 billion).

The theory of debt-trap diplomacy is that the creditor country intentionally extends excessive credit to a debtor country, thereby inducing the debtor into a debt trap.

This is done with the intention of extracting economic or political concessions from the debtor country when it becomes unable to meet its debt repayment obligations. The conditions of the loans are often not made public, and the borrowed money commonly pays contractors from the creditor country. 

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I guess development got different meaning to different people.

:D

But if you kenna debt trapped would you say it was development?

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2 minutes ago, Jamesc said:

Everything sound good until someone said besides the debt.

:D

As of 2020, the countries in Africa with the largest Chinese debt are Angola ($25 billion), Ethiopia ($13.5 billion), Zambia ($7.4 billion), the Republic of Congo ($7.3 billion), and Sudan ($6.4 billion).

The theory of debt-trap diplomacy is that the creditor country intentionally extends excessive credit to a debtor country, thereby inducing the debtor into a debt trap.

This is done with the intention of extracting economic or political concessions from the debtor country when it becomes unable to meet its debt repayment obligations. The conditions of the loans are often not made public, and the borrowed money commonly pays contractors from the creditor country. 

that's exactly what happened. take usa money, buy usa seeds and farm machinery and fertilizer. 

all this does not work in africa because it was a different environment. end up famine. then liveaid for africa.

they dont tell you it was the above program that caused the famine.

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4 minutes ago, Nolicense said:

that's exactly what happened. take usa money, buy usa seeds and farm machinery and fertilizer. 

all this does not work in africa because it was a different environment. end up famine. then liveaid for africa.

they dont tell you it was the above program that caused the famine.

How did usa seeds and farm machinery and fertilizer cause the famine? 

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39 minutes ago, Jamesc said:

How did usa seeds and farm machinery and fertilizer cause the famine? 

there has always been famine occurring in africa. sorry if i made you think that was the main cause and led you to ask the question.

the usual contributing causes are failed harvests, over population, not sharing food, poor logistics, corruption, failed monsoons. locust plague. you name it.

in this cause, loan or aid to "over-haul" the african agriculture was not studied carefully and wholesale solutions were transplanted.

a condition was they used the loan to buy the GMO seeds, machinery and fertilizer from usa.

GMO seeds the harvest you cannot save the seed to replant, which most farmers did.

machinery most farmers dont know how to take care and end up spoil

fertilizer once you start using, you cannot stop. the soil would be depleted with the intensive farming. traditional farming and crop rotation will fail and the land needs years to rehabilitate.

then there is the fertilizer run off and pesticide use required.

find out why the europeans are so against GMO and pesticides for their farming

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(edited)
2 hours ago, Nolicense said:

fertilizer once you start using, you cannot stop. the soil would be depleted with the intensive farming. traditional farming and crop rotation will fail and the land needs years to rehabilitate.

then there is the fertilizer run off and pesticide use required.

中国加油..

China has become the world largest producer and consumer of fertilizer, said the China Agricultural Production Means Circulation Association on Tuesday. China is also a big importer and exporter of fertilizers.  http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchina/2006-10/25/content_716655.htm

https://tradingeconomics.com/china/exports-of-fertilizers

Edited by Odyssey2011
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4 hours ago, Beregond said:

we are already living inside western propaganda thats why many wont feel its not propaganda anymore. cos u already effect and change by it.

i watch news from both side and i try to be as unbias as possible.

like recently china speak up for palestine. does china really care about the welfare of palestine?? i highly  doubt so. in fact they got more interest dealing with israel i think.

its just to strengthen their stand on human right and XJ issue.

 

Yah when china released the wolf warrior movie, the west called it china propaganda

 

why i never hear american sniper or top gun labelled as propaganda movie? In fact alot american war movies showing how they save the local ppl from the bad govt lol

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23 minutes ago, Odyssey2011 said:

中国加油..

China has become the world largest producer and consumer of fertilizer, said the China Agricultural Production Means Circulation Association on Tuesday. China is also a big importer and exporter of fertilizers.  http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchina/2006-10/25/content_716655.htm

https://tradingeconomics.com/china/exports-of-fertilizers

thats unfortunately the reality. petrochemical fertilizers are needed for intensive farming. without cheap fertilizer we wont have cheap and abundant food. stop using and see what happen to price of food. lol

fertilizers can help get your fruits big and sweet. this one you can go take your time to read. 

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7 minutes ago, Thaiyotakamli said:

Yah when china released the wolf warrior movie, the west called it china propaganda

 

why i never hear american sniper or top gun labelled as propaganda movie? In fact alot american war movies showing how they save the local ppl from the bad govt lol

we are so use to stuff like rambos, top gun. the mindset that USA  are heros and all the guys that they killed are terrorist is burn into many ppl minds from young. suddenly they are shown a movie where a chinese are heros. their mind very hard to make a U  turn, i dun blame them. i love rambo also. but we need to differentiate movies and reality.

not only china, big country like russia have also start their trend of such movies that promote nationalism.

but all in all, i find nothing wrong, whats wrong with every country teaching their ppl and youth to love their country. western have been doing that all along, chinese is just warming up.

 

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