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Car or Public Transport - the balance score card


carloverguy2017
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1 hour ago, Philipkee said:

I am going to give an alternative view.

Driving USED to be cheaper than public transport.  During the GFC when COEs plunged and parking was not so expensive and there was cheap petrol in Malaysia, it was worth it.  I was also younger then and I went to places where public transport and taxis were inconvenient. Let you imagine where these places are.

I remember my aunt lecturing me then and my arguments

Your car is the most expensive - COE plunged.  Car prices are on par with the rest of the world

You dont drive to work cos parking is expensive- I am driving ROPC

Your petrol is expensive - I pump in Malaysia 

Your insurance is.... and she kept quiet cos she was selling me the car insurance :D

so it wasnt really more expensive to drive then.  And I believe a lot of people "acquired the taste of driving" then and now when cars are expensive, it's a habit that wont die.

I used to tell my bro.  Cars in singapore are actually not that expensive.  Its the first car that is really expensive cos that is when you start from Ncd 0%.... but once you hit NCD 50% and you want to change cars, even if cars are expensive, you have a car to trade in already.  I was fortunate that my first car was not that expensive during the GFC.

Last time coe was low and $90k you can buy a 2.0L sedan car or even SUV. A mid sedan car only need $50k-60k, people already say expensive liao. Now $90k only can get a korean car or compact sedan car and yet people still can afford to buy. Really dont understand the logic le? Lol.

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18 minutes ago, 13177 said:

Last time coe was low and $90k you can buy a 2.0L sedan car or even SUV. A mid sedan car only need $50k-60k, people already say expensive liao. Now $90k only can get a korean car or compact sedan car and yet people still can afford to buy. Really dont understand the logic le? Lol.

Salary.  A person who earns $3k might afford a car in 2009 for $50k.   The same person might be earning $7k so in theory he can afford over $100k for a car now.

And I would say actually things are not that bad in Singapore.  Our cars and petrol are more expensive than let's say USA or Australia.   But we drive less.  My friend in canada did comment that petrol is half the price in canada as compared to Singapore but daily he drives easily two to three times the distance in Canada.  So petrol is cheaper in Canada but in the bigger picture, he spends more.

Car prices are also not that much cheaper overseas as well in the sense that in singapore,we can buy a 1300 cc car and feel satisfied while overseas you need a minimum of 1800cc if you want to go any distance.  But of cos a 1300 cc car in usa is much cheaper than a 1300 cc car in singapore.

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12 minutes ago, Philipkee said:

Salary.  A person who earns $3k might afford a car in 2009 for $50k.   The same person might be earning $7k so in theory he can afford over $100k for a car now.

And I would say actually things are not that bad in Singapore.  Our cars and petrol are more expensive than let's say USA or Australia.   But we drive less.  My friend in canada did comment that petrol is half the price in canada as compared to Singapore but daily he drives easily two to three times the distance in Canada.  So petrol is cheaper in Canada but in the bigger picture, he spends more.

Car prices are also not that much cheaper overseas as well in the sense that in singapore,we can buy a 1300 cc car and feel satisfied while overseas you need a minimum of 1800cc if you want to go any distance.  But of cos a 1300 cc car in usa is much cheaper than a 1300 cc car in singapore.

Car price still expensive in sg. A 1.3L jap car here can get a full spec 3K conti car there. But in usa repair is much more expensive than sg

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On 11/21/2020 at 3:31 PM, carloverguy2017 said:

Sometimes I find that driving a car out seems to be more of an inconvenient compare to public transport.

Don't get me wrong. Having a car park in the mall, with impromptu purchases, bags of groceries and big item stuffs definitely brings convenient when you know you have a car parked in the mall. Even a trip to Ikea will seems so much friendly when you know you can buy that cute chair for your kids or a small cabinet.

But sometimes when I drive to a mall, knowing I don't have a plan to buy any big items, lots of stuffs, etc. I would prefer to take the public transport.

Here is my balance score card to take public transport, in no priority orders ;

1. I can shop for as long as I wish, no having to worry about the cost of parking.

2. I can visit the mall without trying meet the hourly parking before 4:59 p.m. versus the per entry after 5:01 p.m.

3. I can mall hop from one MRT station to another one without worrying of exiting the carpark and entering another mall's carpark and incurring additional cost.

4. Especially convenient when I can shop from Orchard Ion all the way to Plaza Singapura without having to U turn to pick up the car.

 

What are your thought ?

Besides using the car for work, in fact if you don't even need a car for work, I think probably we will give up driving ?

 

Im a user of both. I mainly drive to work whereas when i go out for gathering, i generally take public transport.

 

Car can provide great ease of convenience for the driver which public transport cannot. For example, i drive to work because i work at the extreme ends of Singapore and sometimes at odd hours which public transport is extremely inconvenience for me. 

 

Other than work, i take public transport as most of the common shopping and makan areas are accessible via public transport. However in cases where it isnt, the car will prove to be extremely convenience and therefore wont not affect you and others along with you.

 

I generally feel that singaporean now tends to prefer this convenience and are willing to commit to owning a car, myself included. Giving up this option will not be easy unless affording becomes an issue.

 

This is just my own opinions and my profile as a driver, there are also other profiles and to each their own unique opinion.(didnt knew driving provide peace to some bros here until i read this trend, good for you guys ya!) 

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30 minutes ago, Philipkee said:

Salary.  A person who earns $3k might afford a car in 2009 for $50k.   The same person might be earning $7k so in theory he can afford over $100k for a car now.

And I would say actually things are not that bad in Singapore.  Our cars and petrol are more expensive than let's say USA or Australia.   But we drive less.  My friend in canada did comment that petrol is half the price in canada as compared to Singapore but daily he drives easily two to three times the distance in Canada.  So petrol is cheaper in Canada but in the bigger picture, he spends more.

Car prices are also not that much cheaper overseas as well in the sense that in singapore,we can buy a 1300 cc car and feel satisfied while overseas you need a minimum of 1800cc if you want to go any distance.  But of cos a 1300 cc car in usa is much cheaper than a 1300 cc car in singapore.

I dont know how much should a person's salary increased over the years? Let say 5-10 years time?

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8 hours ago, 13177 said:

I dont know how much should a person's salary increased over the years? Let say 5-10 years time?

I dunno. I only know I earned about $3000 including allowances in 2009 and about $6000 in 2019....

I was having almost the same designation then and  now. SSN2 vs SSN1 (Senior Staff Nurse)  So it's either the increment is like that or this is unique to healthcare since during this time there is H1N1 Ebola MERS COVID-19 and the pay went up artificially (cos govt pumped in money).

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1 hour ago, Philipkee said:

I dunno. I only know I earned about $3000 including allowances in 2009 and about $6000 in 2019....

I was having almost the same designation then and  now. SSN2 vs SSN1 (Senior Staff Nurse)  So it's either the increment is like that or this is unique to healthcare since during this time there is H1N1 Ebola MERS COVID-19 and the pay went up artificially (cos govt pumped in money).

10 years salary got double?! My salary never double in 10 years lo. Only pathetic salary increment. [:(]

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9 minutes ago, 13177 said:

10 years salary got double?! My salary never double in 10 years lo. Only pathetic salary increment. [:(]

Base is low lor... imagine a cleaner earning $700 a month 10 years ago getting $1400 a month today.  That's also a 100% increment.

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24 minutes ago, Philipkee said:

Base is low lor... imagine a cleaner earning $700 a month 10 years ago getting $1400 a month today.  That's also a 100% increment.

Although base is low, but if 10 years ago earned $700 and now double to $1400, like you said still consider 100% increment lo. My case confirmed no 100% increment. [bigcry]

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On 11/24/2020 at 10:12 PM, Philipkee said:

Salary.  A person who earns $3k might afford a car in 2009 for $50k.   The same person might be earning $7k so in theory he can afford over $100k for a car now.

And I would say actually things are not that bad in Singapore.  Our cars and petrol are more expensive than let's say USA or Australia.   But we drive less.  My friend in canada did comment that petrol is half the price in canada as compared to Singapore but daily he drives easily two to three times the distance in Canada.  So petrol is cheaper in Canada but in the bigger picture, he spends more.

Car prices are also not that much cheaper overseas as well in the sense that in singapore,we can buy a 1300 cc car and feel satisfied while overseas you need a minimum of 1800cc if you want to go any distance.  But of cos a 1300 cc car in usa is much cheaper than a 1300 cc car in singapore.

You forget that cars there do not have a lifespan. Buy a used toyota for 5k and it can last a long long time. 

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4 hours ago, Mkl22 said:

You forget that cars there do not have a lifespan. Buy a used toyota for 5k and it can last a long long time. 

This one I am not too sure. What you say is true.  There is no COE overseas.  But i wonder what is the norm to be driving old cars in USA without restoration? Don't say Myanmar and malaysia and vietnam. I have sat in really old cars and I worry for the vehicle.

Funnily enough I did not worry about my safety.  Maybe its like some of us.  We injured never mind. Dont get the car scratched is more important.

Don't get me wrong.  I know someone who drove a Toyota starlet until 2016...30 year old car.  Just not sure what would be the norm if there was no COE of 10 years in Singapore.

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On 11/24/2020 at 10:47 PM, 13177 said:

I dont know how much should a person's salary increased over the years? Let say 5-10 years time?

Salary should be increased by at least the same factor as inflation. That's assuming you're not progressing in your work.  

By large, most employees will see improvement in their experience and skillset, hence also account for a 3-5% pay rise annually on top of the inflation.

But some do get a whole lot more, some worse. Depends on companies, individual performance and industry.

But salary shouldn't be a direct comparison for one to own a car compare 10 years ago. 

I would compare 20 years ago, I earn a third of what I'm earning now, yet I already drive a car. But those times, there's plenty of cheap parking, free parking, minimal ERP or lack thereof, lesser traffic, cheaper petrol, cheaper parts to repair your car and public transport system was much less interwoven between buses and trains. 

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On 11/25/2020 at 7:12 AM, Philipkee said:

I dunno. I only know I earned about $3000 including allowances in 2009 and about $6000 in 2019....

I was having almost the same designation then and  now. SSN2 vs SSN1 (Senior Staff Nurse)  So it's either the increment is like that or this is unique to healthcare since during this time there is H1N1 Ebola MERS COVID-19 and the pay went up artificially (cos govt pumped in money).

This increment is about just right in today's Singapore. 

Those who couldn't get this rate of increment, may need to think of what's there in your bottleneck.

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6 minutes ago, carloverguy2017 said:

Salary should be increased by at least the same factor as inflation. That's assuming you're not progressing in your work.  

By large, most employees will see improvement in their experience and skillset, hence also account for a 3-5% pay rise annually on top of the inflation.

But some do get a whole lot more, some worse. Depends on companies, individual performance and industry.

But salary shouldn't be a direct comparison for one to own a car compare 10 years ago. 

I would compare 20 years ago, I earn a third of what I'm earning now, yet I already drive a car. But those times, there's plenty of cheap parking, free parking, minimal ERP or lack thereof, lesser traffic, cheaper petrol, cheaper parts to repair your car and public transport system was much less interwoven between buses and trains. 

Could be luck also, if you work in company that cannot pay high salary or back then started off on low side of salary, then over the years salary might not increase a lot.

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When taxing car/fuel/emission no problem... but when distributing those cartax to things like good public tpt service is "subsidy burden" cannot increase blahblah

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