COVID-19: SG to enter Phase 3 from 28th Dec

[Tianmo]

11 minutes ago, Windwaver said:

Still in time!

Thanks bro!!!

In time, in time......

[Kyrios]

31 minutes ago, Nolicense said:

i feel 21 days may be too short. cant explain how the indian variant slipped in for sure. we definitely have the indian variant here

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asia/india-covid-19-b1617-variant-17-countries-singapore-who-14707844

Okai..so how did the birus make its way in to my homeland...issit travel via the stratosphere carried by winds...OR... swam over by way of ocean currents..hmm..any scholar can enlighten me this preambaree three kiddo like me? 🤣 how did it cum in?

Edited May 2, 2021 by Kyrios

[Lotr]

4 hours ago, Playtime said:

Huh?? What other types are there?

One category would be citizens, PRs.

EP, S PASS dunno fall under which category?  Maybe can still fly in.

[Lotr]

4 hours ago, Wind30 said:

I see so many posts about too many indian arrivals, so how many indian arrivals do we have currently every day? 

I have been checking changi airport arrivals these few days. I see about 1 to 3 flights a day

[JanM]

1 hour ago, Nolicense said:

1 is already done. passenger come in is tested. not sure PCR or rapid test..

then compulsory 14 day hotel.. if have home able to isolate then can 14 day at home.

problem is 14 days no longer the incubation period. maybe more with new variants.

not sure if the new variants undetectable by antigen rapid test due to it look for the proteins of the original strain. hope MOH still use PCR test.

procedure is test on arrival. and test at 14 days later. and lift SHN when test negative.

a recovered patient should not have the antigen but may shed genetic material. so hard to interpret the test and need to use serological test to look for antibody..

antibody may also disappear or not develop at all.

so the devil is in the details.

I think the option to allow visitors to stay at home instead of at a dedicated facility is the weak link, especially if there are others staying in the same house.  The instructions may seem comprehensive and reassuring on paper but it is difficult to totally avoid others in the same house.  The visitor could have been infected during the journey here (from taxi driver to the airport, inside the departure hall etc), in which case the PCR test taken immediately on arrival will not pick it up.  Also read elsewhere that spread can occur even before symptoms appear.  Thus the visitor can then unknowingly spread the virus to his/her housemates.  As the housemates are not bound by the SHN, they could in turn spread to the general community.

[Lightbringer]

19 hours ago, Wind30 said:

... I think policy should be DATA driven. 

Let me ask you, do we NEED to open up for the economy??? Simple question right? answer is yes. The harder question is how much to open up...

The right answer I feel is open up slowly until we get spikes in cases. If you feel this way is wrong, how are you going to open up??? Tell us another solution?

So the spike in cases is INEVITABLE. what happens after the spike I feel is the test for the government. 

Do we get it under control or end up like India??

KNN, f**k you understand. Data-driven? How much data do you think is really available, you sorry excuse for a pencil-pushing eunuch talking cock from the safety of your armchair? Do you have data on the characteristics of the different variants and mutuations of the virus coming in? Do you have immediate data on each and every passenger coming in from India, Nepal or other hotspots? Do you have foolproof data on contact tracing and transmission history? Heck, we don't even have reliable data on vaccine performance yet. This is real-world where hard decisions have to be made in the absence of data and the primary objective must be to protect Singapore and Singaporeans. The rest of the world has to deal with it themselves, especially all foreigners - and if you don't like, pls go to hell alongside with them as well.

Just because the spread hasn't become wildfire, just because it hasn't killed thousands of people in Singapore and break down the healthcare system doesn't mean IT CAN'T HAPPEN. You think you can try try play with the virus with your own shitty rules, and then when things goes sideway you can stuff it back into a box and restart again? Sorry virus, my data-driven models failed because of a lack of data, can we restart and try again?

Andrew Cuomo said it best responding to telling retarded desk-warriors like yourself - The alternative is DEATH. What can be worse than death? You think Singapore can't become another India? 

I suggest you go take a dive into a cesspool and shut your quacking and leave the crisis management to people who realise this isn't a game of cards. You go back to playing your SIM cities and wank yourself dry at home. You and that Calvin Cheng are exactly - full of shitty theories and misguided principles because you have no clue exactly what you are dealing with.

The horror and desolation of mass casualties and a raging virus is looming. 

 

Edited May 2, 2021 by Lightbringer

[Lightbringer]

@Kb27 

6 hours ago, Kb27 said:

For a long time, we had almost 0 covid cases, then suddenly there's a big TTSH cluster.

That couldn't have come from the local community. It must have been imported. 

As long as we keep opening for imported cases, there will be just the 1 that slip through and restart all over again.

That's what happens when pencil pushers think they are omnipotent or that the virus is somehow afraid of the PAP machinery, and they can "manage risk" through "risk profiling" and a lot of airy-fairy corporate theories.

Time to put the real men and generals in charge......

[Lightbringer]

15 hours ago, Jamesc said:

Covid is terrible but the saving grace of Covid is that 

it has to be transmitted by a person.

If it was transmitted by insects like mosquitoes or flies then we have very little control.

Say if a person in Singapore had Covid and went to India the Indian gov can stop the person coming in or quarantine them for a month.

If it was a fly or mosquito there is no way to safe guard the border to stop them going into India.

We have one piece of luck and we should use it to the max.

And stop them pesky SGs from bringing it to India and spreading and spreading.

the fear really is that two-ways human to zoological transmission will evolve to the point where it could be transmitted by mozzies or flies as you mentioned. There are already documented cases of humans-to-animals and animals-to-human infection, and the world had better make good use of the time and good grace provided by Mother Nature to get ready for this scenario. 

[Lightbringer]

18 hours ago, Chongster said:

actually who has the whole picture?  you literally cant see the virus.  data driven approach?  the problem is that your data is historical data by the time it is in.  

there is a reason why Australia put whole Perth on a 3 day lockdown when they had a few cases.  because their assumption is that the virus is already out there circulating. 

compare that to what we are doing now.   we here are basically doing selective lockdown - lockdown the places visited by COVID patient AFTER you got the data of person reported sick, tested, got back positive results.    Data driven approach based on outdated data.  Can meh?

 

bingo! when you are fighting an unseen enemy, and there are so many blind spots, you have to assume the worse and act accordingly based on forward expectations of what the worst scenario would be played out and how far ahead you want to be.

an analogy i like to use is when you are faced with a minefield and you need to navigate across - fat hope your simi data driven approach will help you then. even if you had the most reliable data on the location and radius of each mine, are you going to tiptoe around that map reconstructed by your data, or are you just going to send in your mine-clearing vehicle ahead of you regardless?

I would like to see that chap Wind30 cite his data-driven approach and then put his life on the line first.... i'm pretty sure he would be the first to AWOL if asked to navigate the mine field with his own data-generated map!

[Wind30]

3 hours ago, Lightbringer said:

KNN, f**k you understand. Data-driven? How much data do you think is really available, you sorry excuse for a pencil-pushing eunuch talking cock from the safety of your armchair? Do you have data on the characteristics of the different variants and mutuations of the virus coming in? Do you have immediate data on each and every passenger coming in from India, Nepal or other hotspots? Do you have foolproof data on contact tracing and transmission history? Heck, we don't even have reliable data on vaccine performance yet. This is real-world where hard decisions have to be made in the absence of data and the primary objective must be to protect Singapore and Singaporeans. The rest of the world has to deal with it themselves, especially all foreigners - and if you don't like, pls go to hell alongside with them as well.

Just because the spread hasn't become wildfire, just because it hasn't killed thousands of people in Singapore and break down the healthcare system doesn't mean IT CAN'T HAPPEN. You think you can try try play with the virus with your own shitty rules, and then when things goes sideway you can stuff it back into a box and restart again? Sorry virus, my data-driven models failed because of a lack of data, can we restart and try again?

Andrew Cuomo said it best responding to telling retarded desk-warriors like yourself - The alternative is DEATH. What can be worse than death? You think Singapore can't become another India? 

I suggest you go take a dive into a cesspool and shut your quacking and leave the crisis management to people who realise this isn't a game of cards. You go back to playing your SIM cities and wank yourself dry at home. You and that Calvin Cheng are exactly - full of shitty theories and misguided principles because you have no clue exactly what you are dealing with.

The horror and desolation of mass casualties and a raging virus is looming. 

 

... i really think u need to take a deep breath... honestly, relax. Its for your own good. Not good for health

[Wind30]

7 hours ago, Lotr said:

I have been checking changi airport arrivals these few days. I see about 1 to 3 flights a day

Some visitor data i pulled out. I think these does not include citizen and pr. But we should remove all these now with new restrictions.

Funny that these "visitors" stay and average of 1.5 months 🙂 almost 10 times pre-covid duration. 

Edited May 2, 2021 by Wind30

[Philipkee]

8 hours ago, Nolicense said:

1 is already done. passenger come in is tested. not sure PCR or rapid test..

This one I not sure.  Cos let's say a flight from india. My suggestion is the rapid antigen test is done by a MOH or SQ staff in India prior to boarding.  NOT on arrival to Singapore.  Of cos we will still do one on arrival but now we also do one before they board from their airport.

This means that even if the test was already done in the airport or clinic prior to check in, it is irrelevant. Our singapore staff will do another test prior to boarding.  So even if the clinic over there did the test badly, we have also conducted our test.  My impression is that the tests are always locally administered.  For example, hongkong air travel bubble.  Any swab done in changi airport is done by Singapore and not Hongkong authorities.  My suggestion changes this.

Edited May 2, 2021 by Philipkee

[Wind30]

3 hours ago, Lightbringer said:

bingo! when you are fighting an unseen enemy, and there are so many blind spots, you have to assume the worse and act accordingly based on forward expectations of what the worst scenario would be played out and how far ahead you want to be.

an analogy i like to use is when you are faced with a minefield and you need to navigate across - fat hope your simi data driven approach will help you then. even if you had the most reliable data on the location and radius of each mine, are you going to tiptoe around that map reconstructed by your data, or are you just going to send in your mine-clearing vehicle ahead of you regardless?

I would like to see that chap Wind30 cite his data-driven approach and then put his life on the line first.... i'm pretty sure he would be the first to AWOL if asked to navigate the mine field with his own data-generated map!

.... duh... sending your mine-clearing vehicle ahead of a suspected mine field is also using data driven approach... sigh...

honestly, every single government uses data driven approach to handle Covid, even India. It is really just your threshold, how you react to data. Do you tighten with a single case NZ, do you relax when case do down like India?  

you are the ONLY person to think that our government wait for perfect data, which everyone know does not exist in the real world. We have statistics to help to manage inaccuracies and I just had an interesting lesson my on chat group previously about this. I was asking about using the Infection profile in TTSH to estimate th effectiveness of vaccines. Read below if you are interested. At the end of the day, we all survive without 100% accurate data but I really thought it is common sense to keep using the data although impecfect. But as they say about common sense....

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-020-19478-2

Edited May 2, 2021 by Wind30

[Scion]

people say it's not right to ban the (new) citizens from coming home like Australia, not fair to them

but is it fair to the (old) citizens like you and me? putting all of us in risk?

😩

[Wind30]

7 hours ago, JanM said:

I think the option to allow visitors to stay at home instead of at a dedicated facility is the weak link, especially if there are others staying in the same house.  The instructions may seem comprehensive and reassuring on paper but it is difficult to totally avoid others in the same house.  The visitor could have been infected during the journey here (from taxi driver to the airport, inside the departure hall etc), in which case the PCR test taken immediately on arrival will not pick it up.  Also read elsewhere that spread can occur even before symptoms appear.  Thus the visitor can then unknowingly spread the virus to his/her housemates.  As the housemates are not bound by the SHN, they could in turn spread to the general community.

... not sure but I THOUGHT if you have housemates who is not under SHN, you cannot do SHN and need to go to dedicated facilities. correct me if I am wrong. 

[Lotr]

20 minutes ago, mikk123 said:

agreed. Do we really think those who are serving Stay at Home really follow the rules and keeping a distance from the rest of the family? The person who set this policy is out of touch and has no clue of what is happening in ordinary people life. 

Their houses probably have ample space to isolate themselves.  Reminds me of what the son of punggol said "I have a car, my wife has one, we are professional, we need to travel"

[Fcw75]

13 minutes ago, Wind30 said:

... not sure but I THOUGHT if you have housemates who is not under SHN, you cannot do SHN and need to go to dedicated facilities. correct me if I am wrong. 

This one you are right. If you are the only one on SHN and the rest of the household are not, you are not allowed to do your SHN at home. 

But people have been caught for lying until SHN officers go to spot check.

[Fcw75]

Look at this case:

Case 62734

Case 62734 is a 37-year-old female India national who is a foreign domestic worker.

She arrived from India on Jan. 13 and served SHN at a dedicated facility until Jan. 27.

Her test taken on Jan. 26 during SHN was negative for Covid-19.

Following her SHN, she was deployed to her employer’s place of residence.

She is asymptomatic, and was detected when she took a Covid-19 pre-departure test on April 29 in preparation for her return to India.

Her test result came back positive the next day, and she was conveyed to Mount Elizabeth Hospital in an ambulance.

Her CT (cycle threshold) value was very high (i.e. low viral load), and her serology test result has come back positive.

 

What’s this shit? Really special. Come in Jan as a FDW and go back to India in April. Plus no need go NCID, can go Mount E?!

There’s another lady who got berated by MRT staff for not wearing mask properly and she said she’s in social visit pass?? Can meh? KNN...

This one:

https://mothership.sg/2021/05/mrt-staff-scold-woman/?fbclid=IwAR2g_8o9cvi_zvNJGMUEyjo1QULRqejpkxrdiluWnCcYqNm0ZjWnnFzD2Wk

The woman, who is not Singaporean, questioned some of the statements the staff made when he caught her with her mask down.

In the video, the woman is seen addressing the camera directly, and revealed that she is on a Social Visit Pass to Singapore.

Edited May 3, 2021 by Fcw75