Water-cooled cable charges electric car as fast as pumping petrol

[enzoalec92]

https://www.thedrive.com/tech/43155/ford-purdue-cooling-patent-could-charge-evs-as-fast-as-gas-station-fill-ups

<Ford, Purdue Cooling Patent Could Charge EVs As Fast As Gas Station Fill-Ups
Heat management is crucial to faster charging, and this patent has a built-in way to keep things cool.

Battery science is a pretty undeveloped field, which is why we're still using lithium-ion instead of ultra-efficient metal air or sodium chemistry. During the period when burning fuel to generate power was always the easiest option, there wasn't a motivation to make storage a priority and when it comes to EV charging, from infrastructure to materials and methods, we're in the absolute infancy of what might get done. This is why it's extremely cool to see Ford working with Purdue University on a potentially game-changing charge cable. 

The patent's still pending and this isn't in the production stage, so it'd be years before it could be rolled out. But Ford has shared details about the research, which has come up with a solution that could drastically cut EV charging, Ford says, maybe even down to the same amount of time it takes to fill up a gasoline car.

Before I dive into how it works, let's discuss the basics. One of the things about charging a battery, as anyone who's ever plugged their phone in on a warm day will know, is that it gets hot. And as you'll also know from plugging the charger in, it's not just the battery—the cable, the adapter, everything gets real warm because of the current flowing through it, especially as you increase that voltage for faster charging. You can lower how hot parts of it get by using higher-grade, less resistant materials but not only is there a financial cost to that, it also generally means you need rarer stuff and it's not like metals and minerals we're using for technology aren't already a problem. The heating up limits charging and causes the equipment, on the battery and charger side, to degrade faster. 

So one key to improving charging—which is to say, making it faster—is managing that heat. Ford's partnership with Purdue has come up with something pretty interesting, which is a cable made with liquid cooling built into it. 

PURDUE UNIVERSITY

Liquid cooling is pretty fancy, in a battery—AMG is rightly pleased with its direct-liquid-cooled energy store that's basically apeing the Mercedes F1 battery—but it doesn't need spectacularly precious elements. Building it into a cable is clever enough in the first place, given the cable needs to flex but Ford and Purdue's research has also got a stage smarter than anything else around so far.

The cooling agent that the cable uses switches between being a liquid and vapor, which is a heat-reductive process. Like the reason humans sweat, when something vaporizes it takes heat from its surroundings, wicking the excess away from the charging cable wires. That also doesn't require the liquid to be pumped around in order to circulate its heat reduction capabilities.

Purdue mechanical engineering professor Issam Mudawar led on the project, alongside Ford's engineers. In Ford's news release, Mudawar said that a prototype cable should be being tested within the next 24 months, in order to work on seeing how much difference the cable makes to vehicle charging times and how much it increases potential current. That's very exciting, even if it's still a long way off being a production concern, especially because this isn't Ford saying it has a new type of proprietary plug, this is actually a new way to use cooling technologies altogether. 

Although there was quite a lot of bombast in Ford's release about this to say it could bring EV charging times down to equivalent to refueling, that bits in the handwave phase at the moment. We don't know how much it will actually improve charging times or if the system is, for instance, robust enough to withstand thousands of charge cycles—that's the point of research, that it's still getting worked out. But it's a nifty innovation and it'll be interesting to see where it goes.>

Quote

Any Linus Tech Tips viewers here? This sounds just like what his team will do, what with their obsession with liquid-cooling everything — including an air cooler — LOL. 

 

Still, is there someone here who's more likely to get an EV if the recharge time is as fast as filling up with petrol? Personally, I wouldn't mind it for a commuting appliance, but when it comes to driving fun, I still need my engine and manual transmission! 😈

 

[Jamesc]

Why they like to keep putting water with electrical wires!

[Watwheels]

Can install many many pc cooling fans or not? 

[Windwaver]

Hmm, that's not a bad idea.

[DOBIEMKZ]

1 hour ago, enzoalec92 said:

https://www.thedrive.com/tech/43155/ford-purdue-cooling-patent-could-charge-evs-as-fast-as-gas-station-fill-ups

<Ford, Purdue Cooling Patent Could Charge EVs As Fast As Gas Station Fill-Ups
Heat management is crucial to faster charging, and this patent has a built-in way to keep things cool.

Battery science is a pretty undeveloped field, which is why we're still using lithium-ion instead of ultra-efficient metal air or sodium chemistry. During the period when burning fuel to generate power was always the easiest option, there wasn't a motivation to make storage a priority and when it comes to EV charging, from infrastructure to materials and methods, we're in the absolute infancy of what might get done. This is why it's extremely cool to see Ford working with Purdue University on a potentially game-changing charge cable. 

The patent's still pending and this isn't in the production stage, so it'd be years before it could be rolled out. But Ford has shared details about the research, which has come up with a solution that could drastically cut EV charging, Ford says, maybe even down to the same amount of time it takes to fill up a gasoline car.

Before I dive into how it works, let's discuss the basics. One of the things about charging a battery, as anyone who's ever plugged their phone in on a warm day will know, is that it gets hot. And as you'll also know from plugging the charger in, it's not just the battery—the cable, the adapter, everything gets real warm because of the current flowing through it, especially as you increase that voltage for faster charging. You can lower how hot parts of it get by using higher-grade, less resistant materials but not only is there a financial cost to that, it also generally means you need rarer stuff and it's not like metals and minerals we're using for technology aren't already a problem. The heating up limits charging and causes the equipment, on the battery and charger side, to degrade faster. 

So one key to improving charging—which is to say, making it faster—is managing that heat. Ford's partnership with Purdue has come up with something pretty interesting, which is a cable made with liquid cooling built into it. 

PURDUE UNIVERSITY

Liquid cooling is pretty fancy, in a battery—AMG is rightly pleased with its direct-liquid-cooled energy store that's basically apeing the Mercedes F1 battery—but it doesn't need spectacularly precious elements. Building it into a cable is clever enough in the first place, given the cable needs to flex but Ford and Purdue's research has also got a stage smarter than anything else around so far.

The cooling agent that the cable uses switches between being a liquid and vapor, which is a heat-reductive process. Like the reason humans sweat, when something vaporizes it takes heat from its surroundings, wicking the excess away from the charging cable wires. That also doesn't require the liquid to be pumped around in order to circulate its heat reduction capabilities.

Purdue mechanical engineering professor Issam Mudawar led on the project, alongside Ford's engineers. In Ford's news release, Mudawar said that a prototype cable should be being tested within the next 24 months, in order to work on seeing how much difference the cable makes to vehicle charging times and how much it increases potential current. That's very exciting, even if it's still a long way off being a production concern, especially because this isn't Ford saying it has a new type of proprietary plug, this is actually a new way to use cooling technologies altogether. 

Although there was quite a lot of bombast in Ford's release about this to say it could bring EV charging times down to equivalent to refueling, that bits in the handwave phase at the moment. We don't know how much it will actually improve charging times or if the system is, for instance, robust enough to withstand thousands of charge cycles—that's the point of research, that it's still getting worked out. But it's a nifty innovation and it'll be interesting to see where it goes.>

 

I advocate to just submerged the charging cable body in a pool of water. Pure and simple and effective. I should patent that!😁

[t0y0ta]

The main issue is that today the EV batt also cannot ingest so much current without damaging itself. in fact today the charging timing for max fast charging is already good enough for most. The main issue is lack of sufficient working fast chargers, or the "fast chargers" fail to supply even their advertised current due to backend mains limit or battery is already saturated or batt near heat limit.

And if you look at majority of well-used chargers in US and China, keeping them functional to their basic fast charging (50kW or 150kW) is already challenging, many of them subject to harsh weather, rough users and wear and tear.

Still wanna intro more complexity to maintain? 

[Gnahp]

the heat generate has to go somewhere

it warms up the globe

not inline with the EVs propagandas 

[Lala81]

4 hours ago, enzoalec92 said:

https://www.thedrive.com/tech/43155/ford-purdue-cooling-patent-could-charge-evs-as-fast-as-gas-station-fill-ups

<Ford, Purdue Cooling Patent Could Charge EVs As Fast As Gas Station Fill-Ups
Heat management is crucial to faster charging, and this patent has a built-in way to keep things cool.

Battery science is a pretty undeveloped field, which is why we're still using lithium-ion instead of ultra-efficient metal air or sodium chemistry. During the period when burning fuel to generate power was always the easiest option, there wasn't a motivation to make storage a priority and when it comes to EV charging, from infrastructure to materials and methods, we're in the absolute infancy of what might get done. This is why it's extremely cool to see Ford working with Purdue University on a potentially game-changing charge cable. 

The patent's still pending and this isn't in the production stage, so it'd be years before it could be rolled out. But Ford has shared details about the research, which has come up with a solution that could drastically cut EV charging, Ford says, maybe even down to the same amount of time it takes to fill up a gasoline car.

Before I dive into how it works, let's discuss the basics. One of the things about charging a battery, as anyone who's ever plugged their phone in on a warm day will know, is that it gets hot. And as you'll also know from plugging the charger in, it's not just the battery—the cable, the adapter, everything gets real warm because of the current flowing through it, especially as you increase that voltage for faster charging. You can lower how hot parts of it get by using higher-grade, less resistant materials but not only is there a financial cost to that, it also generally means you need rarer stuff and it's not like metals and minerals we're using for technology aren't already a problem. The heating up limits charging and causes the equipment, on the battery and charger side, to degrade faster. 

So one key to improving charging—which is to say, making it faster—is managing that heat. Ford's partnership with Purdue has come up with something pretty interesting, which is a cable made with liquid cooling built into it. 

PURDUE UNIVERSITY

Liquid cooling is pretty fancy, in a battery—AMG is rightly pleased with its direct-liquid-cooled energy store that's basically apeing the Mercedes F1 battery—but it doesn't need spectacularly precious elements. Building it into a cable is clever enough in the first place, given the cable needs to flex but Ford and Purdue's research has also got a stage smarter than anything else around so far.

The cooling agent that the cable uses switches between being a liquid and vapor, which is a heat-reductive process. Like the reason humans sweat, when something vaporizes it takes heat from its surroundings, wicking the excess away from the charging cable wires. That also doesn't require the liquid to be pumped around in order to circulate its heat reduction capabilities.

Purdue mechanical engineering professor Issam Mudawar led on the project, alongside Ford's engineers. In Ford's news release, Mudawar said that a prototype cable should be being tested within the next 24 months, in order to work on seeing how much difference the cable makes to vehicle charging times and how much it increases potential current. That's very exciting, even if it's still a long way off being a production concern, especially because this isn't Ford saying it has a new type of proprietary plug, this is actually a new way to use cooling technologies altogether. 

Although there was quite a lot of bombast in Ford's release about this to say it could bring EV charging times down to equivalent to refueling, that bits in the handwave phase at the moment. We don't know how much it will actually improve charging times or if the system is, for instance, robust enough to withstand thousands of charge cycles—that's the point of research, that it's still getting worked out. But it's a nifty innovation and it'll be interesting to see where it goes.>

 

EV is the future. No need to fight it. I just don't think getting an ev if u don't have landed and have to deal with how humans will handle the limited charging outlets process. The populace mindset needs to be mature. 

Anyway liquid cooling with small radiators is pretty overrated compare to just big air coolers. 

[kobayashiGT]

Then you need to waste more energy to make the car charge faster. Does it help with the zero-emissions? 🤣

 

[kobayashiGT]

13 hours ago, Watwheels said:

Can install many many pc cooling fans or not? 

get bequiet fan. hahaha. more quiet.

[inlinesix]

Currently, fast charging can’t be that fast due to EV electrical architecture.

Most EV runs on 400v architecture.

 

[inlinesix]

6 minutes ago, kobayashiGT said:

get bequiet fan. hahaha. more quiet.

Even porky moved from air-cooled to water-cooled

[DOBIEMKZ]

58 minutes ago, inlinesix said:

Even porky moved from air-cooled to water-cooled

Water cooling is more effective than air cooling right?

[inlinesix]

Just now, DOBIEMKZ said:

Water cooling is more effective than air cooling right?

Definitely.

[DOBIEMKZ]

18 minutes ago, inlinesix said:

Definitely.

Ok got it! Water cooling shall be the primary cooling to take away the heat; and then air cooling is the secondary cooling to cool down the water or water vapour back to liquid form for cooling recycle. 

[enzoalec92]

22 hours ago, Jamesc said:

Why they like to keep putting water with electrical wires!

I get your exasperation is related to my other thread about putting out EV fires LOL but, to answer yours and everyone else's replies below...

21 hours ago, Windwaver said:

Hmm, that's not a bad idea.

 

20 hours ago, DOBIEMKZ said:

I advocate to just submerged the charging cable body in a pool of water. Pure and simple and effective. I should patent that!😁

 

6 hours ago, DOBIEMKZ said:

Water cooling is more effective than air cooling right?

 

6 hours ago, inlinesix said:

Definitely.

 

6 hours ago, DOBIEMKZ said:

Ok got it! Water cooling shall be the primary cooling to take away the heat; and then air cooling is the secondary cooling to cool down the water or water vapour back to liquid form for cooling recycle. 

 

18 hours ago, Lala81 said:

EV is the future. No need to fight it. I just don't think getting an ev if u don't have landed and have to deal with how humans will handle the limited charging outlets process. The populace mindset needs to be mature. 

Anyway liquid cooling with small radiators is pretty overrated compare to just big air coolers. 

...Water is still currently the most efficient medium of conducting heat away from surfaces, hence our continued obsession with it.

Of course, some less heat-intensive components will still be air-cooled if they don't need water-cooling, all in the name of cost-savings.

21 hours ago, Watwheels said:

Can install many many pc cooling fans or not? 

 

7 hours ago, kobayashiGT said:

get bequiet fan. hahaha. more quiet.

Dad, is that you? 😂

20 hours ago, t0y0ta said:

The main issue is that today the EV batt also cannot ingest so much current without damaging itself. in fact today the charging timing for max fast charging is already good enough for most. The main issue is lack of sufficient working fast chargers, or the "fast chargers" fail to supply even their advertised current due to backend mains limit or battery is already saturated or batt near heat limit.

And if you look at majority of well-used chargers in US and China, keeping them functional to their basic fast charging (50kW or 150kW) is already challenging, many of them subject to harsh weather, rough users and wear and tear.

Still wanna intro more complexity to maintain? 

 

18 hours ago, Phang said:

the heat generate has to go somewhere

it warms up the globe

not inline with the EVs propagandas 

 

8 hours ago, kobayashiGT said:

Then you need to waste more energy to make the car charge faster. Does it help with the zero-emissions? 🤣

 

It's all about hiring people to solve a problem that never existed to begin with, all in the name of stimulating the economy! Perfect point being: 

7 hours ago, inlinesix said:

Currently, fast charging can’t be that fast due to EV electrical architecture.

Most EV runs on 400v architecture.

 

More manufacturers are now starting to adopt Porsche's - arguably better - 800V platform, with Hyundai being one of them: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/new-hyundai-ev-platform-brings-800v-charging-310-mile-range

Edited November 23, 2021 by enzoalec92
MCF messed up and deleted all my text WTF

[Jamesc]

I am convinced by your explanation.

I now run all the electrical wires under my MIL bed and make sure the wires are wet to cool them.

21 minutes ago, enzoalec92 said:

I get your exasperation is related to my other thread about putting out EV fires LOL but, to answer yours and everyone else's replies below...

 

 

 

 

 

...Water is still currently the most efficient medium of conducting heat away from surfaces, hence our continued obsession with it.

Of course, some less heat-intensive components will still be air-cooled if they don't need water-cooling, all in the name of cost-savings.

 

Dad, is that you? 😂

 

 

It's all about hiring people to solve a problem that never existed to begin with, all in the name of stimulating the economy! Perfect point being: 

More manufacturers are now starting to adopt Porsche's - arguably better - 800V platform, with Hyundai being one of them: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/new-hyundai-ev-platform-brings-800v-charging-310-mile-range

 

 

[enzoalec92]

7 minutes ago, Jamesc said:

I am convinced by your explanation.

I now run all the electrical wires under my MIL bed and make sure the wires are wet to cool them.

 

 

Be careful what you wish for, her nagging might become more frequent because she no longer has to thermal throttle! 🤬😱

Edited November 23, 2021 by enzoalec92
Stop it MCF, stop attaching the same damn meme photo over and over again FFS!