First ITE graduate to get into NUS medical school

[Vratenza]

Medicine is an art of using science to heal. 

 

Someone very good with math, physics, chemistry and even biology might shine in the individual fields. 

 

Someone very good in language, history, arts, sociology might excel in those fields.

 

But if you think that plucking any of them and plonking them in medicine will guarantee success, you will be sorely disappointed. 

 

Why i say it is an art, because it is not just hard scientific facts, not just black or white, you have to be able to work with greys.

 

Not every human body and individual is alike. Even simplest illness like a common cold, using the same medicine, different people will have different level of severity in presentation, even with the same symptoms, they respond very differently to the same medication.

 

Another factor that needs to come into play is human to human interaction. This is probably the only professional field that has the highest degree of direct human contact be it verbal, face to face and skin to skin. (excluding diagnostic radiology/lab based/mortuary specialties) 

 

Many a times have i seen exceptional Dean's list medical students coming out to working life in hospital flounder when it comes to managing the human interaction and practiceal application of their brilliant mind. Many by natural selection, start to steer towards specialist fields that have minimal patient contact. No right no wrong. We need good people in all fields if medicine.

Just highlighting some seldom mentioned phenonemon outside of the medical circle. 

 

From my experience, grade is not everything in med school. I have seen better doctors produced from non-elite junior colleges Bs medical students than those straight As with full complement of S papers. 

Of course that is my own subject assessment of what constitute good... But in essence, to be able to heal, provide comfort and alleviate patient suffering not just clinically but psychologically is what I feel is the epitome of complete healing. I myself am still working hard to achieve that. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

'A' level maths not so much on mental sums. Can use calculator. It's the stuff like trig, calculus that trips people

As for medical course, need a strong memory and lots of time spent acquiring the stuff to memorize. He don't need calculus and complex numbers.

It's just that our society still has this hang-up over meritocracy drummed in over the years. Just score as many A grade as possible in addition to stellar CCA. We get comfortable with this system because it is objective.

But now govt is trying to shift mindsets to accept a more "grey" subjective system, covering more holistic stuff and this naturally makes people uncomfortable.

In western countries, going to med school and being a doctor or taking a pilot license and being a commercial pilot are just professions like any other. People from diverse educational backgrounds can take it up, even mid-career switch.

 

Edited May 18, 2019 by Vratenza

[Lala81]

I think this "genuine" part discredits the other 1000+ applicants every year who have worked hard to get the grades to apply every year.

There's nothing less genuine about their effort.

I'm sure steelblue's and mason's kids both tried their hardest to get the best grades/CV they could possibly get as well.

 

I mean it's not like this guy got a bad roll of dice in life (unless it's not reported with family issues etc).

I have peers and met juniors that really overcame physical disability, broken families etc to be able to do what they do.

 

It's like saying Lebron James/messi is not genuine cos he's talented. That kinda logic really doesn't roll... 

 

 

True Grit and Perseverance, and "Genuine"

 

Qualities of a Future Good Doc  

 

Edited May 18, 2019 by Lala81

[Lala81]

Certain amount of IQ is needed lah. Ultimately. Not genius level. Maybe 110-120 should be enough?

Anything below that is buay sai ...

Anyone who can be accepted to the local schools SHOULD have the requisite intelligence to pass the course.

 

Though sometimes i wonder. Once in a while, u meet someone whom u wonder how they got in 

 

Medicine is an art of using science to heal. 

 

Someone very good with math, physics, chemistry and even biology might shine in the individual fields. 

 

Someone very good in language, history, arts, sociology might excel in those fields.

 

But if you think that plucking any of them and plonking them in medicine will guarantee success, you will be sorely disappointed. 

 

Why i say it is an art, because it is not just hard scientific facts, not just black or white, you have to be able to work with greys.

 

Not every human body and individual is alike. Even simplest illness like a common cold, using the same medicine, different people will have different level of severity in presentation, even with the same symptoms, they respond very differently to the same medication.

 

Another factor that needs to come into play is human to human interaction. This is probably the only professional field that has the highest degree of direct human contact be it verbal, face to face and skin to skin. (excluding diagnostic radiology/lab based/mortuary specialties) 

 

Many a times have i seen exceptional Dean's list medical students coming out to working life in hospital flounder when it comes to managing the human interaction and practiceal application of their brilliant mind. Many by natural selection, start to steer towards specialist fields that have minimal patient contact. No right no wrong. We need good people in all fields if medicine.

Just highlighting some seldom mentioned phenonemon outside of the medical circle. 

 

[Fcw75]

Certain amount of IQ is needed lah. Ultimately. Not genius level. Maybe 110-120 should be enough?

Anything below that is buay sai ...

Anyone who can be accepted to the local schools SHOULD have the requisite intelligence to pass the course.

 

Though sometimes i wonder. Once in a while, u meet someone whom u wonder how they got in

ASK?

[Vratenza]

Dunnoe man, never tested my own IQ.....

 

I am sure IQ alone can pass MBBS, heck, I have a good friend who had to take supplementary paper a few months later to pass and now an A&E consultant. 

 

EQ and work ethics will get one further professionally. 

 

Certain amount of IQ is needed lah. Ultimately. Not genius level. Maybe 110-120 should be enough?

Anything below that is buay sai ...

Anyone who can be accepted to the local schools SHOULD have the requisite intelligence to pass the course.

 

Though sometimes i wonder. Once in a while, u meet someone whom u wonder how they got in 

 

[Lala81]

ASK?

Foreign grads but local or Malaysian born can be ASK. But generally even then I won't say I distinctly rem anyone who was sub standard.

But local. The competition is intense. Hard to get through without the required grades. Or at least u can only be minimally off. The competition now is even more intense even with perfect scores.

 

Local the only one I was q dubious, I better not say. Haha sensitive topic.

Dunnoe man, never tested my own IQ.....

 

I am sure IQ alone can pass MBBS, heck, I have a good friend who had to take supplementary paper a few months later to pass and now an A&E consultant.

 

EQ and work ethics will get one further professionally.

One of our close friends med group clique is actually our senior who failed final mbbs and joined our mocc. Haha he's also Ed consultant now.

[Staff69]

good to know not all are strawberries generation and the only person looking down on you is yourself

Edited May 18, 2019 by Staff69

[Mason016]

Oh.

i assumed he got the necessary grades to get in.

 

F for a level maths. Ouch.

I got a B and I'm still unhappy with it to this day. Only one in my class to get B.

 

I hope he's ready for the step up.

 

The learning curve is really steep in med school.

He went in via EIS (exceptional individual scheme).

 

I wish him all the very best for med school. Working hard will have a new meaning for him soon.

[Mkl22]

'A' level maths not so much on mental sums. Can use calculator. It's the stuff like trig, calculus that trips people

 

As for medical course, need a strong memory and lots of time spent acquiring the stuff to memorize. He don't need calculus and complex numbers.

 

It's just that our society still has this hang-up over meritocracy drummed in over the years. Just score as many A grade as possible in addition to stellar CCA. We get comfortable with this system because it is objective.

 

But now govt is trying to shift mindsets to accept a more "grey" subjective system, covering more holistic stuff and this naturally makes people uncomfortable.

 

In western countries, going to med school and being a doctor or taking a pilot license and being a commercial pilot are just professions like any other. People from diverse educational backgrounds can take it up, even mid-career switch.

A minister without degree soon?

[Lala81]

He went in via EIS (exceptional individual scheme).

 

I wish him all the very best for med school. Working hard will have a new meaning for him soon.

Law also need to mug a lot. Just that lawyers like to work hard and play hard lol...

[Sosaria]

Law also need to mug a lot. Just that lawyers like to work hard and play hard lol...

Law school got the hot babes, as I recall ... but I didn't dare to approach. Will lose every argument in future Med school, how?

Another Nicholas, luckily it is positive news this time...

 

Joke aside, I admire his courage to take up the challenge. With no full bio and chem background, I see a tough road ahead of him. And maths kills... I sincerely hope he can do miracle and be a role model for all aspiring youngsters who did not do well in their "O" level.

 

All the best Nicholas Chan! Write a history for yourself and do your parents proud!

This is true. Lack of bio and chem at 'A' levels is a bigger hurdle than math. Poly level knowledge is not rigourous enough, in my opinion. Edited May 18, 2019 by Sosaria

[Macrosszero]

There's quite a strong smell of sour grapes here, focused on his background from ITE and his failing F Maths. Elitism much?

 

Be it a late bloomer or someone who simply can't grapple with Calculus, Trigonometry, Vectors or Integrals, he being selected and others not, he managed to turn his life round and get into the program.

 

At least its not based on skin colour or how much donations his parents had made, right?

 

My take is that there is a broad assumption that the most desirable university programs (e.g. medicine/law) are necessarily occupied by the academically-elite. True to an extent but there is such a trend of exam smartness that the academically-elite are merely exam-smart but possess little aptitude and interest to apply their knowledge beyond a superficial level of getting into the career track.

 

I for one support that the School of Medicine has an alternate pathway into the program that allows for individuals that impress with their passion enough that they are allowed the opportunity to pursue their ambition.

 

https://nusmedicine.nus.edu.sg/admissions-medicine/undergraduate#discretionary-admissions

[Lala81]

There's quite a strong smell of sour grapes here, focused on his background from ITE and his failing F Maths. Elitism much?

 

Be it a late bloomer or someone who simply can't grapple with Calculus, Trigonometry, Vectors or Integrals, he being selected and others not, he managed to turn his life round and get into the program.

 

At least its not based on skin colour or how much donations his parents had made, right?

 

My take is that there is a broad assumption that the most desirable university programs (e.g. medicine/law) are necessarily occupied by the academically-elite. True to an extent but there is such a trend of exam smartness that the academically-elite are merely exam-smart but possess little aptitude and interest to apply their knowledge beyond a superficial level of getting into the career track.

 

I for one support that the School of Medicine has an alternate pathway into the program that allows for individuals that impress with their passion enough that they are allowed the opportunity to pursue their ambition.

 

https://nusmedicine.nus.edu.sg/admissions-medicine/undergraduate#discretionary-admissions

At the risk of appearing elitist, He likely failed c math. Not Further mathematics as there is little benefit towards med school application compared to bio or Chem.

It used to be compulsory u take triple science to get into medicine. But now it doesn't apply.

I guess why it's raised eyebrows is that math is about logic as much as learning the rules of mathematics. Which is not different from many other disciplines including medical knowledge.

 

Your assumption that the academically elite possess little aptitude and interest beyond superficial level is also an assumption?

It's like saying cos they got good grades, they must be strawberry.

 

Honestly, the competition nowadays is so tough. It's just like lottery. U may easily have 3-4 applicants for each place who have the exact same scores, roughly same cca background, CV and performance in interview.

Edited May 18, 2019 by Lala81

[Macrosszero]

Your assumption that the academically elite possess little aptitude and interest beyond superficial level is also an assumption?

It's like saying cos they got good grades, they must be strawberry.

 

I make decisions on staff hiring and often they are fresh school leavers just seeing where their degree (and their honours class) takes them. All I need to do is ask a few probing questions about the job they're applying for and it is clear that being qualified isn't quite the same as being suitable. 

[Ash2017]

Correction

 

ITE actually

 

Hahhahah

 

 

I only pray when he graduate from NUS he would not volunteer to be MCF moderator.

The only thing that caught my eye was he got into medicine for the right reasons.

 

pity those ended up in politics. why because after all the training and heavy tax payers subsidy and deprive another who genuinely wants to be a doc. wasted

 

 

 

Another Nicholas, luckily it is positive news this time...

 

Joke aside, I admire his courage to take up the challenge. With no full bio and chem background, I see a tough road ahead of him. And maths kills... I sincerely hope he can do miracle and be a role model for all aspiring youngsters who did not do well in their "O" level.

 

All the best Nicholas Chan!  Write a history for yourself and do your parents proud!

 

[Lala81]

I make decisions on staff hiring and often they are fresh school leavers just seeing where their degree (and their honours class) takes them. All I need to do is ask a few probing questions about the job they're applying for and it is clear that being qualified isn't quite the same as being suitable.

Err OK. That's what Duke is for right. For people who decide to join mid career or after they demonstrated their "passion".

 

To me. Being qualified is a minimum. If u meet the qualifications with some disability or being from lower SES, good for you. If u r best in ite, best in poly, top IB/a level student I don't care. Meet the minimum bar and we will talk later.

Well nus has accepted him so they know him better than us lol.

So all the best to him.

 

BTW, accepting poly students already happened many years ago. Also featured in newspapers then. But there was not much hoohah. And this was before poly became as widely accepted to be a route to local uni as now.

[Ash2017]

Medicine is an art of using science to heal. 

 

Someone very good with math, physics, chemistry and even biology might shine in the individual fields. 

 

Someone very good in language, history, arts, sociology might excel in those fields.

 

But if you think that plucking any of them and plonking them in medicine will guarantee success, you will be sorely disappointed. 

 

Why i say it is an art, because it is not just hard scientific facts, not just black or white, you have to be able to work with greys.

 

Not every human body and individual is alike. Even simplest illness like a common cold, using the same medicine, different people will have different level of severity in presentation, even with the same symptoms, they respond very differently to the same medication.

 

Another factor that needs to come into play is human to human interaction. This is probably the only professional field that has the highest degree of direct human contact be it verbal, face to face and skin to skin. (excluding diagnostic radiology/lab based/mortuary specialties) 

 

Many a times have i seen exceptional Dean's list medical students coming out to working life in hospital flounder when it comes to managing the human interaction and practiceal application of their brilliant mind. Many by natural selection, start to steer towards specialist fields that have minimal patient contact. No right no wrong. We need good people in all fields if medicine.

Just highlighting some seldom mentioned phenonemon outside of the medical circle. 

 

From my experience, grade is not everything in med school. I have seen better doctors produced from non-elite junior colleges Bs medical students than those straight As with full complement of S papers. 

Of course that is my own subject assessment of what constitute good... But in essence, to be able to heal, provide comfort and alleviate patient suffering not just clinically but psychologically is what I feel is the epitome of complete healing. I myself am still working hard to achieve that. 

 

 

the old days of practicing medicine had changed.

 

it is getting to be more defensive medicine

 

look even SMC who are suppose to be fair to doc, recent cases showed their bias towards patients

when they over punish, they cannot undo but need to go court to reduce or undo punishment

 

 

medicine is getting more and more commercialized

respect for doctors are diminishing

the population is getting more educated and some know more about their disease then their own doctor

 

if you are in public hospital how to reconcile the fact that the C class patient who has stage 4 lung cancer cannot afford the 3rd generation chemo but instead being offered the first generation, 

 

I truly feel sorry for those doctors who really have the passion to serve their fellow men but few really can sustain and not succumb to peer pressure.

 

medicine is NO longer the prestigious profession that it used to be

 

but more importantly you wont starve

[Lala81]

Anyway some times the journalist may not feature everything in a short column. He may have other stuff that is left out of the article.