Exercising without a gym

[Chickenbackside]

Yup, I totally agree.

 

There are groups of people who thrive on high carb diets as well. But the common denominator always seem to be a lack of refined processed food.

 

Once again, Kurt Harris puts it succintly: http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/2009/11...e-kitavans.html

 

 

Kitavans eating yams and fish and smoking cigarettes and Tarahumara drinking beer and running on sandals made from old tires! Awesome!

 

Hell, there is some serious neo-rousseauism going on here. These noble savages have got it wired and all of our medical science about nutrition must always take account of those paragons of righteous living.

 

Lindeberg notwithstanding, we don't really know squat about the Kitavans. The runners in the study I just quoted had no clinical history whatsoever of clinically evident heart attacks. Instead, 12% had evidence of silent infacts on an MRI.

 

We have no idea how many of the Kitavans have coronary calcium or silent infarcts by MRI. No idea at all. They certainly seem to tolerate the carbs well with little fructose and no wheat and no linoleic acid. Great! Maybe they have zero coronary calcium and no one there has ever had an infarct. We just do not know. If Lindeberg wants to fly them all to my clinic in wisconsin I will do a calcium score on the first one thousand of them no charge. Seriously.

 

Show me the money. Show me proof they have less atherosclerosis and they have no silent ischemia. Prove they are not just ethnographic confirmation bias for those who think "paleo carbs" must be OK because we really, really want them to be.

 

The Kitavans tolerate a higher carb fraction than you might expect.

 

SO WHAT?

 

What does that tell us about whether we should eat non -fructose and wheat containing carbs intead of animal products. It tells us absolutely nothing at all about that choice. Zero.

 

Just like their apparant tolerance of smoking tells us absolutely nothing about whether it is good to smoke. It only confirms that smoking on the SAD is much worse. That is very interesting, but hardly an endorsement for smoking, is it?

 

This is just a giant, gaping blind spot in the paleo diet world - It is, philosophically, blind empricism. Perseverating on an observation without coherent interpretation.

 

Let's say that fructose, excess carbs in general, wheat and linoeic acid are all equally contributing to ill health. Wheat is probably the worst, or maybe corn oil, but lets just say...

 

Don't you suppose we could find any number of populations, that, lacking the negative synergy of having all of them in the diet, get away with having just one element?

 

I can think of many examples, but I'll let you do the exercise.

 

Fine is not better. Tolerated is not optimal.

 

If you have the choice, why choose corn or potatoes over meat?

 

I have the choice as I am not forced to live in a paleo neo-rousseauist fantasy world. I have central heat and can choose what I eat. Instead of letting it kill me, I choose to exploit our artifical late post-industrial food abundance to my advantage, even if stuffing myself with nothing but tasty animals was a privilege unavailable to some of my unlucky paleo anscestors who had to stoop to starchy plants.

 

Because we have evolved to tolerate getting some portion of our calories from sources that are nothing but fuel (a good thing in times of scarcity, I should say) does not oblige us to do so, does it?

 

I honestly believe with good nutrition, a moderate amount of tobacco and acohol is also tolerable.

 

Does that mean it is better to do it than not?

 

I will always put biomedical science before ethnography.

 

My reading of biomedical science tells me once you have enough protien, animal fat is healthier than any grain or potato. It definitely tastes better. If you prefer to practice a regime of artificial scarcity or save money, go ahead.

 

But this is an advocacy site. I do not advocate substitution of corn or yams for pastured butter unless you are short money or your child is hungry.

 

Between the Zero carbers and the Kitavan cult, I feel a bit squeezed.

 

Over and over I say that the 10- 30% range for carbs sounds reasonable for most people.

 

Prove to me that 60% is better than 30%. Or at least make the argument. I would do it for you if I could, but I cannot even imagine how it would be constructed. Otherwise please stop perseverating on the Kitavans until a study comes out with something new.

[Skunk]

actual calories to reduce obesity and better health.

 

I just downloaded a diet application onto my iPhone (yayy, wife bought one for me lol), and it calculates the nutrition in my diet. My typical daily caloric intake is around 2300 calories, but less than 20g carbs....the typical value is actually around 10grams.

 

I've dropped 3kg and i suspect more is to go, since ketosis is in full swing, with enough acetone in my breath to knock out houseflies lol

 

[Chickenbackside]

How's the beer situation coming along bro?

[Skunk]

How's the beer situation coming along bro?

 

I've quit beer. But i'm drinking whisky, vodka and XO lol....luckily for me, I find that while distilled liquor stalls my weight-loss, at least it doesn't make me gain weight. Strangely, the single day that i lost the most weight, the night before i had 6 shots of vodka lol

[Chickenbackside]

Well, considering the fact that you're still drinking on a regular basis, and can still experience weight loss, it's a good outcome I suppose.

 

More important than weight loss, how do you feel? Better? Pants getting looser?

[Skunk]

Well, considering the fact that you're still drinking on a regular basis, and can still experience weight loss, it's a good outcome I suppose.

 

More important than weight loss, how do you feel? Better? Pants getting looser?

 

I don't defend my drinking, it's a bad habit, but i'm just lucky not to gain weight on distilled liquors. Haiz, i do miss beer though....XO everyday is kinda boring LOL

 

I feel better, more energetic, always feeling full, as compared with the high-protein Atkins Diet i did years ago....yes, pants down 2 belt holes lol

 

I do notice my muscles getting smaller :( but they still have strength....could it be the glucogen inside them getting used up? Or it's an illusion as the layer of fat covering them gets dissolved? lol

 

Tonight whacking Gin and Soda Water heh heh.....zero carb power combo lol

[Chickenbackside]

I don't defend my drinking, it's a bad habit, but i'm just lucky not to gain weight on distilled liquors. Haiz, i do miss beer though....XO everyday is kinda boring LOL

 

I feel better, more energetic, always feeling full, as compared with the high-protein Atkins Diet i did years ago....yes, pants down 2 belt holes lol

 

I do notice my muscles getting smaller :( but they still have strength....could it be the glucogen inside them getting used up? Or it's an illusion as the layer of fat covering them gets dissolved? lol

 

Tonight whacking Gin and Soda Water heh heh.....zero carb power combo lol

As you might already know, every gram of carbs you eat brings along around 3 grams of water.

 

When you cut carbs drastically, the water retention will be the first to go.

 

If you work out with resistance regularly, you will know whether you're losing muscle. 1st sign of muscle wastage is decrease in strength performance. So since you're not experiencing any reduction in strength, you can be pretty sure that you're not losing muscle.

 

Anyway, I'd much prefer the lean striated look of the muscles of a gymnast rather than the puffy bloated look of the muscle of a non competitive body builder.

 

So if I were a girl, I'd say you're getting sexier, haha...

Edited March 20, 2010 by Chickenbackside

[Nolicense]

CBS, my typical diet a day is like 2 hard boiled eggs, belly pork 300g, 1 orange, some greens, some nuts. of cos there are some carbs from garnish like onions and garlic and chillis.. or else hard to eat tasteless food. salt, alcohol, spices to season the food..

 

i'm losing weight very slowly. stable for 3 weeks now.

think i'll have to try smaller portions or if i still get hungry, eat raw carrot and celery.. hahaha

 

but i feel the will is weakening.. i don't miss rice, i just miss the sugar.. the fruits.. the desserts.. ice cream..

i still have to occasional coffee latte.. i'm so weak.. sob

[Chickenbackside]

Hey, we have the same weaknesses bro.

 

I don't get tempted by starchy carbs at all. But sweet stuff, especially of the nonya kueh variety, always tempts me. During times like that, my weapon is coconut cream/milk. Down a can and all feelings of hunger and temptation just stops dead in its tracks. Plus it kinda reminds me of the nonya kueh taste anyway. So it's a good substitute.

 

My encouragement for myself is always looking at my old photos and recalling how I felt physically most of my life: lousy.

 

The temptation will subside as you walk away and occupy your mind with something else. To me, it's exactly like giving up smoking. It was hard for me and I had many failed attempts. But once the seriousness of the bad habit is ingrained within my core, it becomes a lot easier.

 

The problem with going sugar free is that everyone else is doing it and you would be considered a social pariah of you don't go with the mainstream.

 

Maybe you can schedule a cheat day or cheat meal once every week or 2 to eat whatever you want. If you feel really deprived of something, it's no way to go through life this way...

 

I eat pretty clean, but I would cheat once in a while when I come across something that is worth it. It's becoming less often as what I deem as "worth it" is increasing in standard as time passes.

Edited March 20, 2010 by Chickenbackside

[Skunk]

CBS, my typical diet a day is like 2 hard boiled eggs, belly pork 300g, 1 orange, some greens, some nuts. of cos there are some carbs from garnish like onions and garlic and chillis.. or else hard to eat tasteless food. salt, alcohol, spices to season the food..

 

i'm losing weight very slowly. stable for 3 weeks now.

think i'll have to try smaller portions or if i still get hungry, eat raw carrot and celery.. hahaha

 

but i feel the will is weakening.. i don't miss rice, i just miss the sugar.. the fruits.. the desserts.. ice cream..

i still have to occasional coffee latte.. i'm so weak.. sob

 

Try my meal combo. Always feel full. But very expensive :(

 

Breakfast: 4 hard-boiled eggs with a tablespoon of butter and 250grams baked salmon, crusted with black pepper and sea salt mmmm

 

Lunch: 300 grams pork belly sukiyaki stir-fried with Cajun Spice mix....there's a spice mix version from MasterFoods that do not contain sugar or starch.

 

Dinner: 2 pig trotters mmmm

 

Supper: 4 glasses of Gin and Soda, with a little bit of cheese to munch on.

Edited March 20, 2010 by Skunk

[Skunk]

Miss Ice Cream?

 

Whisk up 4 egg yolks, cream cheese and whipped cream and freeze it mmmm

 

Hersheys sells a no-sugar cocoa baking powder...sprinkle that on hehe (but slightly bitter lah....nice aroma though...)

 

Fat is so satiating, i believe there's always a replacement recipe for any sugary thing u can find. Test me hehe.

[Skunk]

Anyone has an ice-shaver at home? I wanna make a low-carb ice kacang hehe

 

Konnyaku Jelly under the ice. I believe certain versions have very low/no carb.

 

Shaved ice on top. Drizzle with coconut milk mixed with vanilla and cocoa essence. Drizzle another layer with melted butter. Everything can be dyed with food colouring to appease the eye.

 

Work-able?

[Chickenbackside]

Won't be near the taste of the original though. I think it will end up like diluted icy coconut milk.

 

I think the things that define the taste of ice kacang are:

 

1) sugar syrup

2) evaporated milk

3) sweetened red beans

[Nolicense]

yes, my standard goes up.. i feel cannot waste my little bit of sinful sugar on dessert that does not meet the mark..

if its not good enough, i will just not eat it.. hehe

[Skunk]

Won't be near the taste of the original though. I think it will end up like diluted icy coconut milk.

 

I think the things that define the taste of ice kacang are:

 

1) sugar syrup

2) evaporated milk

3) sweetened red beans

 

u r brutally honest lol

 

[Topgun]

...i'm losing weight very slowly. stable for 3 weeks now.

think i'll have to try smaller portions or if i still get hungry, eat raw carrot and celery.. hahaha

...

 

If you're hungry just eat coconut cream/milk with some nuts (not too many). Also if you can't give up the latte, have your coffee with butter instead (ie. if you're at home).

 

Carrots and any roots ie. potatoes, yam, all these full of carbs! Celery is better. Even if eating a banana or orange is better than carrots, I think.

 

We all have our weaknesses. Problem is also the guilt I feel when I 'cheat'. Always thinking now that I've attained results that I thought were impossible, I just have this unreasonable feeling that the minute I'm weak and some carbs slip in, I will baloon up and my waist will expand and I won't be able to get into my new jeans anymore I think the discipline will come slowly. And the cravings for all the 'good stuff' will abate slowly. Even the kopi-o siu dai in the morning that I thot I cannot give up, I'm weaning it off. These days, I don't finish a cup, I drink only 1/2 cup. Meantime, I think as CBS advised, we just have to make sure we eat very clean after a 'guilty' or 'cheat' meal.

 

Does that make sense?

Edited March 20, 2010 by Topgun

[Nolicense]

wah bro, you eat so much more than me.. how come you not gain weight leh?

[Topgun]

...The problem with going sugar free is that everyone else is doing it and you would be considered a social pariah of you don't go with the mainstream.

 

...

 

This is the most difficult part I think. And also in a social setting, cos we're not eating the stomach filling carbs, we eating bigger portions of the meat, it's perceived we're eating more than our share of the good (=expensive) stuff