Why COE system is outdated??

[Dragonfly1]

Come on! The reasons COE so high because WE are willing to pay for it!!! Be it because some of you are rich or willing to take huge loans. 'Kia sou' culture with speculations drive up the cost even further!!! Die die must drive a nice car b'cause interest is low, can afford-lah......

 

I am re-living the history of UK economy in 90's, look at EU state of economy now!

[2012]

The system should be changed to make it very painful to buy AND use a car.

COE quotas should be cut further to negative growth - to attain pre-2000 car population.

ERP charges should be raised many times over, extend ERP times, expand CBD fringe and switch to the GPS-tracking system to avert spending taxpayers' money to build more gantries.

 

With GPS-tracking, LTA will achieve island-wide coverage and can implement targeted and selective usage charges based on area/district and directionality.

For example: charge vehicles traveling from East to West between 7am-11am and then again from West to East between 5pm-9pm, very stiffly and painfully.

 

To curtail those who buy cars only to park them at home, allocate a max total number of cars allowed based on dwelling type.

Non-strata Title:

- bungalows >4,000 sqft: no limit

- semi-Ds >3,000 sqft: 3 max

- other landed <3,000 sqft: 2 max

Stata Title:

- town houses: 2 max

- condo/apartments: 1 max

- HDB & others: 1 max

Give the people a good public transport system first.... Then come back to talk....

[Kiadaw]

COE thread just never die!

 

Anyway, my view. COE, or any hard cap on cars is required. You can have all the other fancy methods to rise car ownship that is not link to a hard cap, it will likely fail, as Singaporeans (not all, of course) are well known to purchase outside their comfortable means! Somehow they will find a way to have a car if a hard cap is not set. Borrow money, loan etc

 

Also, more 'uglyness' of Sinagpore will be reveal if you say charge base on milage or similar. You will find people that will not offer rides to others, or expect some friendly charges when people ride with them. Or people will try to make sure tehy meet in a place near & convience to them, or find excuses not to meet up if the distance is too far, or theey feel , not worth the car charges.

[Camrysfa]

Today

[Timbuktu]

The recent slashing of COE supply to less than a third of what it was 4 years ago is not right. “ The veh quota system should contribute to a more sustainable vehicle population growth pattern, with as little social, economic and political cost as possible”

I would think that pumping in even more COEs to satisfy the people's "wants" and leading to gridlocked roads and daily traffic snarls, would have a much more profound social, economic and political impact and cost!

 

Let's be very clear - it's not what you people want!

The country, it's government, commerce, economy and transportation infrastructure must remain functional, above all else.

Edited August 2, 2012 by Timbuktu

[Camrysfa]

 

No, not advocating pumping in more COEs...... I am sure the ST columnist is not just championing for the B&B market. Fact is the spiralling COE premiums affect the welled heeled too. And business cost, etc.

 

Thing is, the ministry has got it

[Expertz]

I think you (like many here) are missing one fundamental understanding of COE. The $60K is not a fixed price decided by the govt. It is the COE QUOTA that is controlled and the resulting "price" of the COE is via tender (i.e. COE exercise). Mind you, Cat A is now almost $70k. In a few weeks time we are looking at maybe $80K.

 

So if we follow your suggestion of increasing road tax to $60k, how will that control car population? Yes, it may dissuade a few who not able or not willing to fork out $6k annual road tax but there is no fixed limit to the number of cars sold, i.e. anyone willing to pay this road tax can buy car. The most important element of COE is the COE itself is limited to fixed number every month. THAT is the thing that reduces the vehicle population, not whether the COE PQP is $10k, $50k, or 100k.

 

my suggestion is no different from the current system but it'll allow banks to charge more than 10% interest when people decide to borrow $$ to pay off road tax. this money will then be recycled into the economy and will benefit everybody

 

also 60k is just an indicator price. govt can always take the average price of COE over the past 10 years and add in 1% increase every year. the end result is the same as the current COE system. cars will not be any cheaper but there will be added benefits as i've stated.

 

of course if you are rich enough to afford to pay 10k per year on roadtax then naturally you'll be happier to pay 80k to buy a COE under the current system

Edited August 2, 2012 by Expertz

[Expertz]

But their performance hasn't been that great when citizens do not contribute ideas, no?

 

COEs are really a blunt tool when it comes to maximising road usage. I feel the ERP would do a better job of it while satisfying the urge for car ownership. GCT got it partially right when he approved the weekend car scheme.

 

Of course there are collateral issues of parking and such but that will resolve itself and reach saturation/equilibrium once owners realise that paying through the nose for ERP just does not justify the need for owning a car. Many will then sell their rides after KPKB against the govt.

 

i'm 100% against the idea of ERP.

ERP shifts traffic from 1 road to another. a driver who makes a detour to avoid paying ERP which keeps his car on the road for a longer period.

what we want is for the driver to reach his destination as soon as possible so that traffic will be free flowing.

 

the reason why you feel ERP is good is because you are not affected by it much.

if we scrap COE and used ERP to maintain traffic control, you'll end up having to past thru 10 or 15 ERP grantries in a single drive from the east to the west. when this happens, there'll once again be outrage at the number of ERPs and the govt will have to solve yet another problem.

i think that'd be like simply sweeping your problems under the bed and waiting for s--t to hit the fan

[Satrianeo_2012]

Anyway COE is here to stay because 60.1% voted for it.......

 

As I said, if it works, the world would be using it right now....

 

Btw, making things expensive to render it unaffordable is the simplest way to deter pple from buying it......... YOu don't need rocket science to implement it.

 

Apparently, our highest paid leaders could only implement the simplest method on this planet which no other countries would want to use.....

[Satrianeo_2012]

Common sense will tell that there is no equality at all in COE. It does nothing than to allow the rich people own as many luxury cars as they want but the peasants cannot even afford a single BB car....

 

Thats why it can never be implemented in other countries. There will be massive protest. Thats why other countries are cracking their heads to reduce car population and design better roads etc....

 

SG just take the simplest route.... Make it expensive.

[Expertz]

Anyway COE is here to stay because 60.1% voted for it.......

 

As I said, if it works, the world would be using it right now....

 

Btw, making things expensive to render it unaffordable is the simplest way to deter pple from buying it......... YOu don't need rocket science to implement it.

 

Apparently, our highest paid leaders could only implement the simplest method on this planet which no other countries would want to use.....

 

100% agree!

i've said this before many many times previously!

 

you know what is the more logical and painful way?

by building more roads

 

[Satrianeo_2012]

Btw, equality doesn't exist in SG........ Its a FACT...

 

Just look at the sentences handed out.... killing people on the road just 1 day jail???

 

 

[Gendut]

i'm 100% against the idea of ERP.

ERP shifts traffic from 1 road to another. a driver who makes a detour to avoid paying ERP which keeps his car on the road for a longer period.

what we want is for the driver to reach his destination as soon as possible so that traffic will be free flowing.

 

the reason why you feel ERP is good is because you are not affected by it much.

if we scrap COE and used ERP to maintain traffic control, you'll end up having to past thru 10 or 15 ERP grantries in a single drive from the east to the west. when this happens, there'll once again be outrage at the number of ERPs and the govt will have to solve yet another problem.

i think that'd be like simply sweeping your problems under the bed and waiting for s--t to hit the fan

 

 

If traffic shift to another road, then put a gantry there and ewverywhere.

 

You're totally wrong to say my intent is becqause I won't be affected. Oh please. Everybody will be affected, including the rich. If I have to, I'll just walk. I have a choice not to drive.

 

Your problem is that you're mixing a simple technical problem with a political solution. Nothing ever gets done that way. Set an objective, craft the soultion and be damned roll out the pain.

 

Any other way, is politics.

[Timbuktu]

Btw, making things expensive to render it unaffordable is the simplest way to deter pple from buying it.

The elegance of it all.

Simple, yet damn effective in directly controlling the total number of cars 'deemed' allowed on the road.

Cheap to implement too (we're talking of COEs here, not ERP hor)

 

[Timbuktu]

i'm 100% against the idea of ERP.

ERP shifts traffic from 1 road to another. a driver who makes a detour to avoid paying ERP which keeps his car on the road for a longer period.

Agree. +1

 

ERP will not reduce the number of cars on the roads.

It will just spread the same mad number of cars wider, circulating across all arterial roads ... toward those w/o ERP gantries.

ERP will only just keep more cars on the roads, longer. Pure stoopidity IMHO!

Impact on economic efficiency, GHG emission and costly fuel consumption.

 

In addition, having to put more metal on the ground with costly electronic sensors ... will just be a waste of tax payers' money!

 

The LTA would still favor the COE knob.

Revenue-generating and yet has the ability to 'disappear' cars from our roads when needed!

 

 

[Dxyong]

Expensive car with pleasant driving condition.......cheap car with jam every where and most people late for work.....ur choice :p

[Timbuktu]

Common sense will tell that there is no equality at all in COE. It does nothing than to allow the rich people own as many luxury cars as they want but the peasants cannot even afford a single BB car....

Like public housing, the not-so-rich (sorry, the term you used?) continue to have full access to public transport.

Equality?

How do you propose allocating landed property ownership in the prime districts to the not-so-rich?

Your analogy. No?

 

What is wrong with public transport, when public housing (aka HDB) is considered perfectly alright?

 

 

[inlinesix]

i'm 100% against the idea of ERP.

ERP shifts traffic from 1 road to another. a driver who makes a detour to avoid paying ERP which keeps his car on the road for a longer period.

what we want is for the driver to reach his destination as soon as possible so that traffic will be free flowing.

 

the reason why you feel ERP is good is because you are not affected by it much.

if we scrap COE and used ERP to maintain traffic control, you'll end up having to past thru 10 or 15 ERP grantries in a single drive from the east to the west. when this happens, there'll once again be outrage at the number of ERPs and the govt will have to solve yet another problem.

i think that'd be like simply sweeping your problems under the bed and waiting for s--t to hit the fan

I support scrapping COE as it is an outdated model. Instead, ERP should be constructed in all major roads on this island. ERP should starts from $10 as long as rolling 3 mths average speed drop more than 10km/h of legal speed. It will help to control traffic but ppl aspiration to own car. No car park? That's each & every individual problem.