Magic Jet

[Vtim]

bro, me quit taking 'ang mo liang teh' back in 95 liao

[Genie47]

No point because you know what I might or might not be installing into your car. Your psychology start to act already.

[Genie47]

Ahem.... Vtim I am here to announce your arrest.

 

Under Section 4 of the Human Cloning Act, you will be arrested for performing human cloning. Your twins will be seized as evidence. Be prepared tonight for my anticloning task force to take you to jail.

[Vtim]

how can you do that to me, you & Julian are also product of human cloning hor

[Genie47]

That time, the law not in existence yet.

[Vtim]

like that not fair ley

[Hattee]

Wa what an arrogant remarks, even Lambo drivers won't want to make. To them just another 65bhp is ain't performance.

 

What the hell is Magic Jet in the Performance Folder?

 

This is thing is not performance. In my vocabulary of performance:

 

1. Port and Polish the cylinder head to increase Volumetric Efficiency. S$600

 

2. 5 angle valve job. S$10/valve

 

3. Complete valve replacement to stainless steel single piece forged construction with stem reduction. S$40/valve

 

4. Forged connecting rods from Carillo. S$1700 for 4 pcs.

 

5. Stage X camshafts. S$1100 for DOHC 16v

 

6. Swap turbochargers. S$2000 for ball bearing turbos

 

7. Change the pulley of superchargers. S$300

 

8. Gear ratios. Change final drive. Fit an LSD. S$4000

 

9. Change the suspension gemoetry. Coilovers. S$2500

 

10. Exhaust swap. S$800 to S$1500

 

11. Engine tuneup with piggy back or complete ECU. S$1000 to S$5000

 

 

All these are very heavy investments. If you have little money, don't waste it for the small things. Save it for bigger things mentioned here.

 

Don't try any small things like Magic Jet unless these guys are selling you a contraption that uses water to fuel the car.

 

Magic Jet is purely a Gimmick. If it is that good, WRC teams for F1 teams will use it.

 

Don't mod your car if you don't have the cash. You have bought engineering services from the manufacturer, use it.

 

For all the power increments, heavy modders in this forum will tell you that above stuff will work. Not some Magic Jet. It works on Magic. Get it?

 

I have made my past car from 155bhp 2.0L car to 210bhp. With subtantial gains in torque and yet driveable on the street. All the above mentioned paths will lead to increased power and torque.

[Lordalfa]

Dear sir,

 

You are the one with arrogant remarks. Do you know how much effort is it to squeeze 5bhp from an NA car?

 

From your statement, you own a Lambo and stick Magic Jet next to the filter?

 

If you don't know what you are reading, just ask. Nobody will call you stupid.

 

I have modded NA cars to higher power. I have changed NA cars to forced induction. I have been there and done all the things.

 

Your arrogance by placing Magic Jet to so called increase fuel economy or power is an insult to us in the automotive engineering field.

 

We don't study thermodynamics and fluid mechanics for nothing. Don't tell me to stick something next to my air filter and expect to improve my fuel economy without affecting air flow?

 

The combustion engine is essentially an air pump. Improvements will be made by increasing capacity, density of air, compression air, more oxygen. NOTHING else will work unless you dear sir have a method to defy Newtonian Law's of Physics. If you can, you are GOD. If you are GOD, do some Magic for my engine.

Edited February 25, 2005 by Lordalfa

[Firefox]

It's gd to share views and experinces here, so everyone learns faster n cheaper also. All gets to benefits. It always happen that we dnt all agree on everythings, all can voice up but may be we shld try to be alittle tactful and careful abt our way of expressing.

 

Believe everyone here dn't meant to be offensive. Just got a little carried away in use of words.

[Kytl68]

I think so too ..... some get so carried away that they try to make themselves sound like expert and others idiots ... but at the end of the day ... we are suppose to be learning from each others experience and not "shooting" each other.

 

I believe most Singaporean are quite rich and they only do things that are proven but expensive .... you don't need a mechanical expert in Dynamics and Physics to know that ... as long as you have money, even a primary school leaver who drives a car can still get the extra HP ... only difference is he does not understanding how is comes about ... bottom line is he pays and his money buys him mod power.

 

At the same time, I also believe that by virtual of innovation and improvement in technology, some mechanical improvements will still be possible but they may not be in line with what you learn when you were in school ....like example who would have thought that by having a better material in your filter, you will get better combustion ... that was until people like K&N start telling you that ... over time it proved to be true ... and the list goes on.

 

.... but people like Newton will not be so fortunate if he lives in this era as his idea about gravity will be shot down by many people in this forum

 

For the records (and those too tired to read from the beginning) ... my stand on Magic Jet on my car (just a KIA 2.0 A) is that it helps me improve my FC by about 5-6% since the installation about 3 months now. Don't know if the power has increased (since I don't have dyno to proof it) but it sure it a smoother ride now and whether my head is playing tricks on me or not, the car is indeed more responsive.

Edited February 25, 2005 by Kytl68

[Genie47]

.... but people like Newton will not be so fortunate if he lives in this era as his idea about gravity will be shot down by many people in this forum

 

There is a difference. Newton's work was reviewed by his peers who went out to prove that he was wrong and in the end had to admit he is right. You shoot someone down when he only has an argument. You cannot shoot someone down easily when he has numbers written in stone. Such is the scientific process. Someone stakes a hypothesis, the others design experiments to observe the phenomenon to see if the hypothesis is true. If it cannot be disproved, therefore it is true.

 

I believe most Singaporean are quite rich and they only do things that are proven but expensive .... you don't need a mechanical expert in Dynamics and Physics to know that ... as long as you have money, even a primary school leaver who drives a car can still get the extra HP ... only difference is he does not understanding how is comes about ... bottom line is he pays and his money buys him mod power.

 

That statement my friend had you answering the most crucial question. These snake oil mods are hardly worth your money. Real mods are very expensive. Instead, trust what the engineers from the auto maker had done for you.

 

For the records (and those too tired to read from the beginning) ... my stand on Magic Jet on my car (just a KIA 2.0 A) is that it helps me improve my FC by about 5-6% since the installation about 3 months now. Don't know if the power has increased (since I don't have dyno to proof it) but it sure it a smoother ride now and whether my head is playing tricks on me or not, the car is indeed more responsive.

 

In line with what I said above, you are indeed on shakey ground. Without numbers, people will question your credibility. Even if you fervently make a stand, people will take you for a religious zealot.

 

Yes, we learn from each other in a forum but we do not take things at face value when there are no numbers to show. Take your pick, testimony or credibility.

 

BTW, I can easily get 6% improvement in horsepower by just changing my oil from a 50wt to a 20wt. Way cheaper too.

 

Would you like to get the makers of Magic Jet to do a double blind test?

Edited February 25, 2005 by Genie47

[Hattee]

If shafting others low cost attempt as not performance and boasting about his "vocabulary of performance: 1. Port and Polish the cylinder head to increase Volumetric Efficiency. S$600 2. 5 angle valve job. S$10/valve 3. Complete valve replacement to stainless steel single piece forged construction with stem reduction. S$40/valve 4. Forged connecting rods from Carillo. S$1700 for 4 pcs. 5. Stage X camshafts. S$1100 for DOHC 16v

6. Swap turbochargers. S$2000 for ball bearing turbos 7. Change the pulley of perchargers. S$300 8. Gear ratios. Change final drive. Fit an LSD. S$4000

9. Change the suspension gemoetry. Coilovers. S$2500 10. Exhaust swap. S$800 to S$1500

11. Engine tuneup with piggy back or complete ECU. S$1000 to S$5000"

 

if this is not arrogant, what else is?

[Genie47]

Actually, those who don't want to know the truth are the arrogant ones. The point is that true enhancements costs so much that the snake oil alternatives (if they can be considered alternatives at all) are just merely con jobs. In the end, saving that money used for the snake oil for real petroleum products is more viable.

 

The numbers quoted by him is proof that it takes a lot to make 65 horsepower. What numbers do the Magic Jet makers/users have to show besides testimonials? S$70 to produce 4 nanowatt of power ooops, let me revise that 4 attowatts of power?

 

I like him would advocate using the services offered by the automobile engineers in designing that hunk of depreciating piece of machinery if big ticket performance items are not your thing. It is not perfect but it gets you where want to go.

 

PS. Nano is 10 the power of -9. Atto is 10 the power of -15.

Edited February 26, 2005 by Genie47

[Kytl68]

"""" BTW, I can easily get 6% improvement in horsepower by just changing my oil from a 50wt to a 20wt. Way cheaper too. """"

 

I am referring to improvement in fuel consumption not horsepower

 

.... and how can oil chane be cheaper than S$65 if you need to change it every 10K or about 3 times a year .... assuming difference in oil price is about S$20 so that's about that works out to about S$300 over 5 years (since magic jet is suppose to last 5 years)

 

..... anyway, it will be interesting to find out how can you improve further in your horsepower if you are already on 20wt

 

.... I hope that changing from 50 to 20 will also help you improve on your FC ?

 

..... I agree that maybe if the supplier or people from Magic jet is reading this forum, they should do a blind test like you have said and if the result is favourable, it will help those blind people out there open their eyes to their product ... it will at least further improve their sales ... not that anyone is going to believe that they have actually done it and it will still be just another testimonial .... but let's hope they do.

 

.... for you info. magic jet is not a snake oil mod ... it's just an add on device like the fuel magnet.

 

.... thanks for sharing your opinion ... I am still on firm ground never shaky .... don't need to be .... "it's for me to know and for you to find out"

Edited February 26, 2005 by Kytl68

[Genie47]

This is the reason why our math teaching may the best in the world that the Americans copy but our creativity is in the schlumps. For an increase in horsepower, you don't depress your gas pedal hard to get the same results. Less effort for more movement, isn't that better FC already? The cheapest 5W20 Royal Purple. 4qts cost $41 at most.If you cover 30-40k km in a year, the most you spend is only 41X4. If you like Redline and pay that kind of money. It is still money well spent. Maybe you only need 2 oil changes in a year for Redline.

 

Then why should I want to get more horsepower after using 20wt oil? I have already maxed out lubricant technology already! Maintain the lube system of the car and at the same time get more horsepower. Creative isn't it?

 

Finally, Magic Jet still has unsubstantiated infalted claims. Until numbers are shown, it is still a snake oil.

 

Great examples of items that was elevated from snake oil status to enhancement products are Lube Control and AutoRx. You need to see BITOG for the results. They have hard numbers from users of the control of oxidation in engine oil (Lube Control) and engine cleanliness (AutoRx). You see, unless there are numbers to show, snake oil it is.

 

Finally,

"it's for me to know and for you to find out"

 

Isn't this the Ah Q mentality that Hattee talks about?

Edited February 26, 2005 by Genie47

[Slonez]

There was a review of Magic Jet in this issue of Hot Stuff I think.

Pretty impressive fuel saving >25% !

Anyone else tried?

[Genie47]

Any more data than just an overinflated claim of >25%? It is only their word you know? Not the findings from an unbiased independant tester who conducted let's say a blind test with at least 2 controls.

[DarkLord]

Not to mention some statistics for the various car makes!