Waterspots

[Maddriver]

Autobahn says it contains PTFE, and it works. Why you want to ignore it? Now you look at the Autobahn, water repellent is very good right? Now if you see the how the water bead with the Swissvax Shield (with PTFE), you'll see that the shape of the water beading is different. The water 'balls' are more rounded. Anyway, there are so many types of Teflon PTFE, some are meant for unsintered, meaning no need baking. http://www2.dupont.com/Teflon_Industrial/e...fe/aqueous.html

 

About nano, because the new paint technology creates a different paint. Normaly polishing particle size are too bit to get in and polish effectively. e.g. Sonax nano polish (professoinal series) stated the particles are so small enough to be effective on new scratch resistance paint. Sure, some people use the term NANO too often and too easily and confuses certain people. http://www.sonax.com.au/ask_der_schmickmeister.php Go read the Q12.

 

To conclude, there are tons of information out there. But we have to grap the technical side as tight as we can. Know what you're doing, know what's the best for you car.

 

What we are looking for from a teflon to work like how it suppose to work on a non-stick frying pan that all..Like you have say..There are many types of Telfon and i think not all are meant for paint..What I know from DG chemist when I visited them..They have teflon in most of of their products but they do nothing except for giving the paint a very very slick finish that all...

 

But seriously I would like to learn how to see a more rounded water "ball"..

Edited January 1, 2009 by Maddriver

[Renegade777]

Dear Forumers,

 

I need your expert advice on waterspots.

 

I visited http://www.qmi.com.sg/car.htm at IMM level 3 for car polishing and was quoted $250 for the job. After I collected the car, I was told that waterspots were unable to remove and needed to respray the car inorder to remove the waterspots. They also told me that the waterspots has "eaten" into my paintwork and even by removing it, the paint work will be damaged in long run.

 

I am totally confused now and the waterspots are clearly visible under flourecent light. I am happy with the TEFLON coating but really upset with the water spots

 

Bro,

 

I don't know will work for you or not and this is my experience. I have tried many polish ranging from $80 to $100 dollars, some were mobile companies but none is able to remove my car water spot marks.

 

Last Saturday, sent my car to CSII for polish and they managed to removed almost all the watermarks. I am very happy even though it cost me $300++. No point going for those cheap cheap polish if you want to rid these water marks.

 

Anyway, my ride is black and two years old leow.

 

 

 

 

 

[Four4s]

Autobahn says it contains PTFE, and it works. Why you want to ignore it? Now you look at the Autobahn, water repellent is very good right? Now if you see the how the water bead with the Swissvax Shield (with PTFE), you'll see that the shape of the water beading is different. The water 'balls' are more rounded. Anyway, there are so many types of Teflon PTFE, some are meant for unsintered, meaning no need baking. http://www2.dupont.com/Teflon_Industrial/e...fe/aqueous.html

 

About nano, because the new paint technology creates a different paint. Normaly polishing particle size are too bit to get in and polish effectively. e.g. Sonax nano polish (professoinal series) stated the particles are so small enough to be effective on new scratch resistance paint. Sure, some people use the term NANO too often and too easily and confuses certain people. http://www.sonax.com.au/ask_der_schmickmeister.php Go read the Q12.

 

To conclude, there are tons of information out there. But we have to grap the technical side as tight as we can. Know what you're doing, know what's the best for you car.

 

let's just say that i'm a cynical consumer cos i've come across many ad-agencies in my current industry. I do try to understand the techy side but I'm also on the look out for marketing gimmicks.

I look at how well autobahn works over time, but I wouldn't know if it's mainly the wax portion or the PTFE doing most of the work.

About nano, it's just that every product claims nano-technology.. PPS, polishes, sealants etc... if i was very convinced abt it, i wouldn't use a wax, e.g. collinite, ever again and just used sealants. Nano techy in polishes... I have no reason to doubt that, but most PTG only measures in microns. Scratch resistant paint requires harder abrasives to break it down... not necessary smaller ones (tho i can appreciate using smaller ones for a finishing polish)... but if you market your polish as having harder abrasives, your avg consumers will start worrying that it's too strong to use on their cars.... hence nano technology (i.e. smaller is better).

I'm not dissing any product though... just that i'm cautious about the marketing gimmicks.

Edited January 1, 2009 by Four4s

[Picanto]

free ads for CS II is it? what works for you may not work for others. from the way you promote this company, can we conclude that you are their staff?

 

[Davc]

Happy New Year guys

 

Different wax/sealant have different water beading. When I say certain product works, I don't mean all the products in the market that contains one same ingredient works. See? e.g. I spray the Meg #135 on my SV Mystery.....the beading actually got worse..... Finally when I top it up with SV nano express the good beading came back I don' care about ingredient actually, only result matters. About the SV shield let me expain more. There is this day at night with street light, it was raining and the droplet look like pearls! My friend just said his car is on SV shield. Unless he was hiding his 'secret' formula lah Maybe one day I'll buy a tub and do a 50/50 test against my SV Mystery.

 

And many LSP products mentioned 'contains carnauba wax' also don't mean that they are the same right? That's an over simplified line of thought. So if a few products say contains PTFE, why do you expect them to be all the same? PTFE is already a sub-category of Teflon and there are 3 types of PTFE and more sub sub categoy......

 

Actually MENTOS also contains carnauba wax too , you don't ask why they not as glossy as your car right? They just happen to have same ingredient doesn't mean they are the same.

http://www.kyrene.org/staff/sreed/Science/...ngredients.html

 

Nano doesn't mean less abrasive. Take another brand Meg as example even though the didn't use the term NANO I just think this is a good example to explain. The particles in Meg #105 is smaller than #85, but it is more abrasive. I say again, there are many people who uses this term, judge for yourself. Anyway just becareful when using products with words like 'abrasive', 'heavy -cut', 'fast cutting' if you're not sure.

 

I've never used CSxx, and personally probably will never use. He he and they are not the only one who mentions PTFE as the ingredient lah.

 

To conclude again, I not really supporting anyone, but I have to admit my favourite wax is SV though, it works for me. About PTFE it's just a general material used in marine, or even manufacturing of nut and bolts. So please do not argue whether it's good or not, it's just one of the possible ingredient.

 

By the way I just used the System 2000 pad washer today, very efficient. Basically after every pass, I wash the pad, my friend's car super oxidised. (Disclaimer: please do not ask why I only support System 2000 or Lake Country, it just happen I used one, and it is good).

 

Happy detailing.

Edited January 1, 2009 by Davc

[Maddriver]

Different wax/sealant have different water beading. When I say certain product works, I don't mean all the products in the market that contains one same ingredient works. See? e.g. I spray the Meg #135 on my SV Mystery.....the beading actually got worse..... Finally when I top it up with SV nano express the good beading came back I don' care about ingredient actually, only result matters.

 

Meg#135 should have some cleaner that rip off SV mystery...Could be SV nano contain nuba that gives back beading again?

 

Take another brand Meg as example even though the didn't use the term NANO I just think this is a good example to explain. The particles in Meg #105 is smaller than #85, but it is more abrasive. I say again, there are many people who uses this term, judge for yourself. Anyway just becareful when using products with words like 'abrasive', 'heavy -cut', 'fast cutting' if you're not sure.

 

Any claim from this??

 

 

Edited January 1, 2009 by Maddriver

[Davc]

Meg #135 supposed to be safe on the wax/sealant. If applied on top of wax, it should be #135 in effect. Look wise, also SV Nano Express is better, in my eyes. The thing about SV nano express is that they never tell anyone what's the content.....whether it's 100% synthetic or contains some carnauba like the Zymol Field Glaze. I tried to find answer but nobody knows.....then I decided to just look at results.

 

Meg #105 is on the abrasive scale of 12 and #85 is on the scale of 10. About the particle also, #105 don't breakdown and their particles are smaller than #85 (before breakdown). Yes, smaller particle yet cutting more. Amazing.....but personally I think for Japanese paint I'll use it with Maroon pad at most instead of wool. It also can be used with hand accrording to instruction. And the 2009 formula they approved it to be used with a DA!!! Guys now the decision to whether buy a DA or Rotary is harder than ever with this 2009 formula for #105. I went to the Meg pro training. However I didn't asked about comparing the size of the particles of #105 VS #85(after breakdown), but many times, people finds that #105 doesn't leave too much swirls (at www.meguiarsonline.com).

Edited January 1, 2009 by Davc

[Maddriver]

Meg #135 supposed to be safe on the wax/sealant. If applied on top of wax, it should be #135 in effect. Look wise, also SV Nano Express is better, in my eyes. The thing about SV nano express is that they never tell anyone what's the content.....whether it's 100% synthetic or contains some carnauba like the Zymol Field Glaze. I tried to find answer but nobody knows.....then I decided to just look at results.

 

That could be 135 is just a detailer by itself...

 

Take another brand Meg as example even though the didn't use the term NANO I just think this is a good example to explain. The particles in Meg #105 is smaller than #85, but it is more abrasive. I say again, there are many people who uses this term, judge for yourself. Anyway just becareful when using products with words like 'abrasive', 'heavy -cut', 'fast cutting' if you're not sure.

 

So to say this is just your finding and experience...Not cliams from their chemist themselves???

 

 

Edited January 1, 2009 by Maddriver

[Davc]

Meg #135 supposed to be safe on the wax/sealant. If applied on top of wax, it should be #135 in effect. Look wise, also SV Nano Express is better, in my eyes. The thing about SV nano express is that they never tell anyone what's the content.....whether it's 100% synthetic or contains some carnauba like the Zymol Field Glaze. I tried to find answer but nobody knows.....then I decided to just look at results.

 

That could be 135 is just a detailer by itself...

 

Take another brand Meg as example even though the didn't use the term NANO I just think this is a good example to explain. The particles in Meg #105 is smaller than #85, but it is more abrasive. I say again, there are many people who uses this term, judge for yourself. Anyway just becareful when using products with words like 'abrasive', 'heavy -cut', 'fast cutting' if you're not sure.

 

So to say this is just your finding and experience...Not cliams from their chemist themselves???

 

#135 is good, just that I prefer the result of SV Nano Express. I forgot the SV is like 4-8 times more expensive than #135....so.....if I use wax like Meg #16 I'll stick with #135. But if I'm applying some premium wax....surely Nano Express. Top 3 panels I sure use premium wax, but the side (especially lower panels) panels normal wax will do lah. Always use premium wax brankrupt loh.

 

About the particles on #85 and #105 it's claimed by Matt Davis the Asia Pacific Meguiars trainer, he drew it out on the white board and explained during training. Let me check, if still have the picture inside my computer, I'll post that photo of the diagram he drew. It was early Nov 2008. Don't think he's a chemist though. I have his email if you want. Also there are some threads we discussed on Meguirs USA forum with their staff about exact thing, how to work on a non-breakdown compound plus other information. Major difference is you can stop when you want to stop, not necessary to work till it diminish (breakdown).

 

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23748

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28363

http://meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthrea...8390&page=2

 

So coming back to the question of water mark. I always find water mark very annoying. Was working on my friend's car. Oxidation and watermarks removed but, still there are small dots there (look like the effect of etching). So tempting to compound it with #105 and wool pad, Honda told me factory paint is thin and said if I want the paint to last, it needs the clearcoat thickness's protection..... ...is there any suggestions? I can't borrow their bodyshop's PTG becuase they said the new car checking people borrowed to check on new cars haven't return to them.....

 

 

 

[Four4s]

Ah.. i know that Matt Davis has been going around to a few car grooming centers armed with a G220 and M105 to entice them to switch to megs polishing line. Didn't know he was holding an open workshop tho.

 

the leftover cursed small dots after compounding!.... it's like little craters... probably acid rain etching. yah, i was thinking only wetsanding can solve that problem.

[Davc]

But my friend's car has been to detailing shop every 3-4 months but condition was bad because petrol station washing and constant outdoor parking, and he has seen his detailer using wool pads a few times, but don't know which kind of wool pad and what's done exactly. Knowing this history, I really not comfortable sanding his car....My friend also lah. These people 'cumulate' enough oxidation/marks/swirls then go detailing, sure the poor detailer use wool pad every time.....

 

Someday if I rich have to get that PTG.....damn it.....without that thing it's like operate on a patient without X-Ray.....

Edited January 2, 2009 by Davc

[Dennisk]

Any pics to share for the oxidation and swirl removed and also the water marks on your friend's car...

 

Where you attended the workshop? might be interested to go for the workshop to learn more...

Edited January 2, 2009 by Dennisk

[Davc]

ABOUT TRAINING

 

Hypercoat is the Meg dealer in Singapore. Actually can talk to them. Usually they really set up the lecture room well, then product demo, have discounted items, have goodie bag etc. 1/2 a day. Last time I was talking to one of their sales then he spoke to Matt, then we gather people and organised it loh. They very helpful. They demo removing water marks and swirls on a black camry.

 

Don't know why cannot post image.......

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3220/300008...43988dd.jpg?v=0

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3026/299923...bc1188f.jpg?v=0

 

ABOUT MY FRIEND'S CAR

 

Didn't take photo of his car. Because his black car I tell you from 2-3m away, it looks perfect, reflection and gloss like crazy, but cannot show the defect properly. But recently bought a panasonic LX-3 can take macro at 1cm maybe then can see the defect, haven't try.

 

I put Zymol Titanium on the top 3 panels, Meg #16 at the side panels.

Edited January 2, 2009 by Davc

[Four4s]

ABOUT MY FRIEND'S CAR

 

Didn't take photo of his car. Because his black car I tell you from 2-3m away, it looks perfect, reflection and gloss like crazy, but cannot show the defect properly. But recently bought a panasonic LX-3 can take macro at 1cm maybe then can see the defect, haven't try.

 

I put Zymol Titanium on the top 3 panels, Meg #16 at the side panels.

 

Try putting under direct florescent lights and take at angle almost parallel to the top panel (e.g. bonnet).... you should be able to see those bloody spots. haha!

 

what was your friend using as a LSP prior to your correction session?

[Davc]

I cannot say it because unfair to that brand. My friend didn't add any protection for 4 months and expose to the sun on daily basis.

 

Actually the first thing I discussed with him after polishing is how he should wash his car in the future.

 

He got no time to wash car. So I ask him to pre mix some good car shampoo. Mist the whole car. Then ask the petrol station to just jet the whole car (not using their shampool) Finally use own cloth to dry from top to bottom. This is what he can do with minimum effort and inflict less swirls. Since pay S$ without shampoo ask them to jet the car longer lah. Do this during weekday when necessary and weekend wash the car again more carefully loh. This would mean 8 car wash a month, pretty good already. Once every 4-6 week use cleaner wax, followed by a wax that he likes.

[Admin]

Picanto, this is a forum for sharing, and Renegade777 is just sharing his positive experience with the company/product. Why do you want to draw unnecessary conclusion from it?

 

FYI I also did my CS II about 2 weeks ago and I am very happy with the results so far. So a thumbs up from me as well.

 

free ads for CS II is it? what works for you may not work for others. from the way you promote this company, can we conclude that you are their staff?

[Renegade777]

free ads for CS II is it? what works for you may not work for others. from the way you promote this company, can we conclude that you are their staff?

 

Hi Picanto,

 

Please read properly and think before jumping to conclusion leh. No good to assume hor. It tells a person what we are like.

 

Anyway, I did mentioned "don't know whether CSII will work for him or not". Also, I am not their staff or as a matter of fact, I have not seen the owners of CSII let alone knowing them. I am a complete stranger to them. I just get to know their works thru my carforum, made appointment because CNY coming, went for the polish and here I am please with it for they removed those watermarks on my two year old black car. I have tried some mobile ones but none works for me and I felt what a waste of time and money. Of course, there are good mobile polishers here too.

 

No hard feelings. Me just sharing with brothers here and of course things may work for me but may not work for others. Just share share only and me no profit or acquaintance with any of them. Happy New Year.

 

 

 

 

[Chogokin]

If they manage to remove yr watermarks tat has been stay on yr 2 years old car , tat could actually remove quite alot of clear coat from yr paint work. Unless they use glaze to hide it .