Accident analysis discussion

[Kar_lover]

NO, biker has some fault to bear. I would say biker should be 30-40% of responsibility..

 

ANd now for english lesson.....its "wracked" with guilt......not "wrecked"

 

haha....please, its "wrecked" la....aiyo, want to teach me english not so easy.....

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/wreck

 

 

When key in "wrack", no such word found.

 

You can also use your MS Word to check.

[Kia0042]

 

 

Nobody will admit fault when involving a minor car accident, especially singapore drivers, they rather be a coward.

[Itsec]

its ur friend's "story" against the rider's story lor...

 

dont bother who's right.. we have no right to judge how many percent .. and true accountability dont always reflect in the statement...

 

technically (if i'm right), bikers shall always stay behind cars.. and there's no over-taking allowed on single white lane... if the rider wan to go overtake, he had to horn to alert the car infront... create awareness...

 

 

[Kar_lover]

That's what I'm trying to drive at :

 

Due to your friend's negligence (of not keeping proper lookout, and by that it mean all possible angles), an accident occurred.

Not signalling by itself may not be that bad. But in this instance, it is potentially the cause of this accident.

 

It could be the other party's faulty because he did something illegal, but that doesn't mean we can do something to cause an accident, can we?

 

To the authorities, I think its most likely 50-50, if points and fines are involved.

But to the insurance companies, it could be a totally different discussion.

 

At which point did i say he "can cause an accident" just cos the biker was riding on the on coming lane?

 

I tink proper lookout is all reasonable angles, not all possible angles. I give u a scenario. u driving on left side of left lane as u intend to enter petrol kiosk on the left. of course as u are approaching the turn in, u look out in front to make sure no pedestrian walking across the entrance of the petrol kiosk. Are u sure u will check ur left mirror that got no cyclist behind u on ur left (between u and the road kerb) going straight? The cyclist behind u is supposed to look out for u whether u are making the turn just as u are looking out for pedestrians in front of u walking across the kiosk. Each person behind supposed to look out for the situation in front (and of course, my favourite, keep a safe distance).

 

 

 

 

 

[Chrispie]

2 cams pointing to the front and back will make things very easy for the surveyor to determine who's at fault. We can argue all we want, but when it reaches the insr side, they will just say 50/50 to close the issue since its your friend's words against biker's.

 

In these cases, even though the bike is not supposed to overtake from the side (one lane.. duh.. ), but when its a collision, any party involved will kena some liability. So.. i say, take it and move on. There is almost no way to verify anyone's claim. Giving both the benefit of doubt, 50/50 will be the outcome.

 

I was involved in an accident with a taxi recently, as much as i believed its not my fault ( i was in lane all the time, taxi veered into mine without checking blindspot and hit my rear back), and with the pictures submited to AIG, and them calling me to tell me my story is more believable, and only offered 20% to the other party, they just informed me that final outcome is 50/50. So? Paying so much for insurance is just for the right to drive, not really for protection. To really protect yourself, defensive driving, and installing cams for evidence is the way to go.

Edited June 26, 2010 by Chrispie

[Darryn]

haha....please, its "wrecked" la....aiyo, want to teach me english not so easy.....

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/wreck

 

 

When key in "wrack", no such word found.

 

You can also use your MS Word to check.

 

Hee...why am I not surprised that you would want to argue the point? And why am I not surprised that you are wrong...

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/wracked

 

Please check carefully next time.

 

I can tell you right now, go and ask any journalist or competent english speaker which is correct

a) Wracked with guilt = consumed with guilt

b) Wrecked with guilt = no such construction, can be "wrecked by guilt" which is a different discussion....

 

If you really wanna go down this road, please go and find three cites for me that "wrecked by guilt" has been used in writing.

 

If you can do this I will double it in the phrase wracked by guilt.

 

[Kar_lover]

its ur friend's "story" against the rider's story lor...

 

dont bother who's right.. we have no right to judge how many percent .. and true accountability dont always reflect in the statement...

 

technically (if i'm right), bikers shall always stay behind cars.. and there's no over-taking allowed on single white lane... if the rider wan to go overtake, he had to horn to alert the car infront... create awareness...

 

Actually there is no dispute in terms of the story. the question is who is more in the wrong in this accident. I feel bad that my fren is so depressed and guilty over the whole thing while the biker so "yaya" demanding full compensation + extras when actually i feel biker more at fault or at worst 50-50.

 

Of course we don't have the right to judge; i m here to ask for opinions or if someone who has had the same situation happen before, can shed some light on wat the outcome was.

 

Ultimately the only view that matters is the insurance company's view.

 

 

[Desmondtwb]

At which point did i say he "can cause an accident" just cos the biker was riding on the on coming lane?

 

I tink proper lookout is all reasonable angles, not all possible angles. I give u a scenario. u driving on left side of left lane as u intend to enter petrol kiosk on the left. of course as u are approaching the turn in, u look out in front to make sure no pedestrian walking across the entrance of the petrol kiosk. Are u sure u will check ur left mirror that got no cyclist behind u on ur left (between u and the road kerb) going straight? The cyclist behind u is supposed to look out for u whether u are making the turn just as u are looking out for pedestrians in front of u walking across the kiosk. Each person behind supposed to look out for the situation in front (and of course, my favourite, keep a safe distance).

 

Sorry to say, I do make a check of my left before turning in.

I never make assumptions that others will follow rules or even having common sense.

 

[Krado]

Can't be right? Cos thousands of ppl don't signal.....

 

So if thousands of people die on the road every year, its ok to die?

 

If you're too f--king lazy to signal, then blame yourself for being too f--king lazy.

[Chrispie]

Actually there is no dispute in terms of the story. the question is who is more in the wrong in this accident. I feel bad that my fren is so depressed and guilty over the whole thing while the biker so "yaya" demanding full compensation + extras when actually i feel biker more at fault or at worst 50-50.

 

Of course we don't have the right to judge; i m here to ask for opinions or if someone who has had the same situation happen before, can shed some light on wat the outcome was.

 

Ultimately the only view that matters is the insurance company's view.

 

 

precisely.. we all know its in the insr company's hands now. So.. even if we all say its biker's fault, it does not help the situation. Dont worry over what you cant control. Keep fnger's crossed and hope for the best.

[Itsec]

Actually there is no dispute in terms of the story. the question is who is more in the wrong in this accident. I feel bad that my fren is so depressed and guilty over the whole thing while the biker so "yaya" demanding full compensation + extras when actually i feel biker more at fault or at worst 50-50.

 

Of course we don't have the right to judge; i m here to ask for opinions or if someone who has had the same situation happen before, can shed some light on wat the outcome was.

 

Ultimately the only view that matters is the insurance company's view.

 

let the insurer decide... simple as that... who cares about demand this/that....

Dont let the angers/emotions get over your head.... let it be.. driving in SG is stressful...

 

if the biker wan demands, ask him to talk to ur friend's insurer...

if i encounter this situations... i will just report everything to the insurer... let them decide.. if the biker threaten, just call police.. hahhaaaa

 

what CAN the biker do then??

 

from now on, ask ur friend to get a in-car recorder... preferably wide angle/high res.... in this situation, it might not help.... but at LEAST, with the video submit... it will able to tell the car is slowing down, there's a entry at the right side of the road... it will aid the insurer to judge...

[Darryn]

Seeing as how I have to whack you over the head with a mallet...

 

1 Example 1

2. Example 2

3. Example 3

4. Example 4 "Simba, the beloved son, is wracked by guilt and impotence until the ghost of his father gives him instruction on what actions he should take". From here

5. Example 5 "What Dreams May Come. The character Annie, wracked by guilt over the death of her husband Chris, commits suicide and is damned to hell" From here

6. Example 6 "It seems that these days, wracked by guilt at the humanitarian crisis it has created in the Middle East, the West has turned to Africa for redemption."...From the Washington Post no less

 

Do you want me to continue or is this enough?

Edited June 26, 2010 by Darryn

[Krado]

The biker should overtake him on the left side

 

Where on earth did you get your license from.. ?

 

[Desmondtwb]

Seeing as how I have to whack you over the head with a mallet...

 

1 Example 1

2. Example 2

3. Example 3

4. Example 4 "Simba, the beloved son, is wracked by guilt and impotence until the ghost of his father gives him instruction on what actions he should take". From here

5. Example 5 "What Dreams May Come. The character Annie, wracked by guilt over the death of her husband Chris, commits suicide and is damned to hell" From here

6. Example 6 "It seems that these days, wracked by guilt at the humanitarian crisis it has created in the Middle East, the West has turned to Africa for redemption."...From the Washington Post no less

 

Do you want me to continue or is this enough?

 

Thanks for the lesson, all along I thought it was wrecked by guilt.

Now I know

[Chrispie]

Thanks for the lesson, all along I thought it was wrecked by guilt.

Now I know

 

 

same here!! hahaa...

[Kar_lover]

Hee...why am I not surprised that you would want to argue the point? And why am I not surprised that you are wrong...

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/wracked

 

Please check carefully next time.

 

I can tell you right now, go and ask any journalist or competent english speaker which is correct

a) Wracked with guilt = consumed with guilt

b) Wrecked with guilt = no such construction, can be "wrecked by guilt" which is a different discussion....

 

If you really wanna go down this road, please go and find three cites for me that "wrecked by guilt" has been used in writing.

 

If you can do this I will double it in the phrase wracked by guilt.

 

Dun want to waste time on this. for me, "wracked" is for "wracking my brains.....", i.e. voluntary wracking. Wrecked with guilt is where a person's conscience is behind "destroyed" or "ruined" by feeling of guilt (non-voluntary). Maybe i meant, wrecked by guilt, happy?

 

And by the way, a competent english speaker may not help here cos in terms of speaking, wreck and wrack sounds the same. The speaker does not have to know whether it is "a" or "e". By the way, i am a (former) NUS national debater (albeit long time ago). Not dat i want to yaya but since u mention competent speaker...and journalists are not perfect either.

 

 

 

[Raffy1996]

Yes i know he didn't turn on the indicator but wat abt the biker keeping a safe distance? And riding against the flow of traffic? I guess u're a biker too. So the difference in ur case that u had a number of near-miss (but not an actual accident) is cos u kept sufficient safe distance to cope with the unexpected. If u're behind a car and the car is slowing down as he is approaching a junction, u dun anticipate he might be turning in?

 

In fact often when i am coming out of a carpark and intending to turn right to join the main road, if there is an on-coming car from the right, even if his signal is showing that he is turning into the carpark which i am coming out from (which means i can proceed to exit the carpark), i still wait until i make sure he is really turning in before i proceed. You should never trust the signal (or lack thereof) and/or the driver 100%.

 

Sidetrack (which someone mentioned above): What drivers and bikers should do to really really keep safe, is to assume all other road-users are idiots, that their decisions can never be predicted. And even if they can, random probability strikes sometimes! Cliched but true - better to be safe than sorry.

 

Edited June 26, 2010 by Raffy1996

[Kar_lover]

Where on earth did you get your license from.. ?

 

sigh, i m not saying that over taking on left is right thing to do. but given the scenario, where my frens car was the right edge of the lane and there is a carpark entrance on the right (which should have suggested to the biker that my fren was turning right into the carpark), if the biker no patience, die die want to overtake got 2 options: overtake by the right (against the flow of traffic and the possibility that car is turning right) or by left which while strictly speaking is not correct but no (or less) forseeable danger.