FT son trying to siam NS

[Boyboy]

Heh - One of my ex-colleagues, his family run off to Australia when he was like 2 years old, they took up AU citizenship on his behalf, when he came back and tried to work here the govt wouldn't let him.

 

I got in-laws in this predicament. Fair la.. But too bad, miss out on Singapore food

 

I think can come back, is just that will kena charged/DB.

[Bystander50]

To me a more interesting question is this: if guys are paying back the gahmen for educational subsidies, etc. by doing 2 years of NS + all that ICT, then what are the girls doing to repay their "debt"? They get the same subsidies, don't they?

 

Please *don't* rehash what that stupid MiniStar said about women doing their National Service by having babies (in which case should the women who choose to remain unmarried or childless be asked to pay back their debt in cold, hard cash?).

 

Also, it is no longer true that women are a less-privileged group than men. With the Women's Charter and the 2-year headstart they have in working life, women have it really good compared to men. Yet noone talks about them paying back a debt to society. And it's also dead easy for them to renounce their citizenship compared to guys. Where's the parity? It's just looking like really bad luck to be born a guy (rather than a girl) in Sg.

 

If you made all girls serve NS, I would've no complaints. Until they do, the system is very unfair.

 

There are certainly many non-combat vocations woman can serve. And serving NS not necessary must be under SAF for these women.

They can be deployed to train and serve as nurses and in a national crisis, there is a ready pool of first aid responders. In a war, combat medics can attend to the causalties and bring them back to the rear hospitals taken care by these nurses.

And there are still other vocations such as clerks, manning police posts while the policeman can move out to do patrolling ... there are just so many possible ways to deploy these female, and these highly paid ministars can't even think of.

 

If female's duty is to give birth, then what if they don't give birth/have babies? Can charge them?

 

 

[1fast1]

There are certainly many non-combat vocations woman can serve. And serving NS not necessary must be under SAF for these women.

They can be deployed to train and serve as nurses and in a national crisis, there is a ready pool of first aid responders. In a war, combat medics can attend to the causalties and bring them back to the rear hospitals taken care by these nurses.

And there are still other vocations such as clerks, manning police posts while the policeman can move out to do patrolling ... there are just so many possible ways to deploy these female, and these highly paid ministars can't even think of.

 

If female's duty is to give birth, then what if they don't give birth/have babies? Can charge them?

 

Couldn't agree more.

 

Problem is: even oppo will be afraid to push this for fear of losing female votes.

Edited December 3, 2011 by Turboflat4

[Csnewbie]

On point no.4, FT serving NS can only throw dummy grenade and fire blanks. No need to waste live rounds since they will be gone when the war starts.

 

 

And when he needs a GF ...allow him only an inflatable adult toy. [laugh]

[Scb11980]

sometimes i wondered why anybody even bother to discuss this issue

 

our government, right or wrong, reasonable or unreasonable, say this is like that

it becomes law

 

furthermore, clowns give them the mandate

to carry out as what they wish for another 5 good years

 

discuss, here and there, like as if, you people got b a l l s to walk up to the minister or PM to tell him otherwise

 

 

hence, accept the fact,

life goes on

 

 

other issue that you guys may want to think carefully

especially when more than 80% of the population lives in HDB flats

we are leasee and when we rent the flat, the process is called sub-leased by HDB

since when does lease have to pay property tax

furthermore, if this statement is true

then doesnt it constitute daylight rubbery

this had been brought up in another thread

 

 

there are many bread and butter issues

all these lampa and palam (to and fro) discussion to see who is more correct

is a bloodly waste of time

if you really care do something about it if you think you are right

 

if you think ministers are correct

call them and tell them you support them

and give them the thumbs up

 

maybe next election may see you be an MP

 

[Albeniz]

To me a more interesting question is this: if guys are paying back the gahmen for educational subsidies, etc. by doing 2 years of NS + all that ICT, then what are the girls doing to repay their "debt"? They get the same subsidies, don't they?

 

Please *don't* rehash what that stupid MiniStar said about women doing their National Service by having babies (in which case should the women who choose to remain unmarried or childless be asked to pay back their debt in cold, hard cash?).

 

Also, it is no longer true that women are a less-privileged group than men. With the Women's Charter and the 2-year headstart they have in working life, women have it really good compared to men. Yet noone talks about them paying back a debt to society. And it's also dead easy for them to renounce their citizenship compared to guys. Where's the parity? It's just looking like really bad luck to be born a guy (rather than a girl) in Sg.

 

If you made all girls serve NS, I would've no complaints. Until they do, the system is very unfair.

 

true. girls could also serve ns by working 2 years in hospital drawing an allowance, this way we could rely less on foreign nurses.

 

[Aristotle]

true. girls could also serve ns by working 2 years in hospital drawing an allowance, this way we could rely less on foreign nurses.

 

Then you will see an influx of fake or keng cases, where those DOM get themselves injured to be hospitalized just to ogle at JC and poly gals

[Scoots]

Absolutely yes. If they have citizenship in another country they should be allowed to renounce anytime they like. Is basic human right to self determination. Just like the right to choose to renounce or follow religion.

 

Your sentence had been nagging at me in the back of my mind... couldn't really verbalise what I disagree with until now.

 

"Is basic human right to self determination. Just like the right to choose to renounce or follow religion"

 

It is more correct to draw a parallel of citizehship to the parent-child relationship, rather than to equate to choosing/following a religion. And looking from that parent-child angle, I cannot agree that a child's "basic human right" is to disown his/her parents at his whim and fancy. There are obligations to each other just so from the relationship that the parties were born into

Edited December 3, 2011 by Scoots

[TVT]

Darryn hasn't been through NS. not a personal attack or jibe at him, but I seem to remember that he's a PR from some other place (is it NEW ZEALAND?) and didn't have to serve due to age or whatsoever.

 

Anyone who has been through NS will not think like him.

No wonder he's (Darryn) always either 'sitting on the fence', or defending the FT !

 

Yah lor, I agreed too that those who had served NS will not think like him (Darryn) ! Another group are girls/women (not all, but the majority) - they too will be indifferent cos since they didn't serve and won't understand.

[TVT]

I'm all for scrapping NS, actually. But I don't believe in preferential treatment, either. (if NS cannot be scrapped, I actually feel that the ladies should contribute as well, then pay them just as well as the guys when they join the corporate world, instead of paying guys more because 'they have served NS')

Scrap NS then SG could be invaded by foreign forces anytime! This is not a good idea. Also once there's no NS, govt may allow dual citizenships for foreigners, like that even worse. One of the main reasons the govt didn't allow dual citizenships here was becos of NS.

 

Yes, agreed fully that girls should served NS. Maybe not in combat vocations, but in hositals, or social service, or Police force/prision/immigration/customs. There must be something they can contribute to the nation.

[TVT]

To me a more interesting question is this: if guys are paying back the gahmen for educational subsidies, etc. by doing 2 years of NS + all that ICT, then what are the girls doing to repay their "debt"? They get the same subsidies, don't they?

 

Please *don't* rehash what that stupid MiniStar said about women doing their National Service by having babies (in which case should the women who choose to remain unmarried or childless be asked to pay back their debt in cold, hard cash?).

 

Also, it is no longer true that women are a less-privileged group than men. With the Women's Charter and the 2-year headstart they have in working life, women have it really good compared to men. Yet noone talks about them paying back a debt to society. And it's also dead easy for them to renounce their citizenship compared to guys. Where's the parity? It's just looking like really bad luck to be born a guy (rather than a girl) in Sg.

 

If you made all girls serve NS, I would've no complaints. Until they do, the system is very unfair.

Even if the woman give birth, the men also need to 'help out' with the chores (feed baby, change diapers, etc)...if men don't, the women will then complain 'not fair', 'not equal', etc. So we men are doing 'NS' the 2nd time?

 

So whatever happens, women always want to be better than men in SG. The Women's Charter is long outdated. With the modern women now earning higher salaries, they no longer (now) are a disadvantaged group. If they want everything to be fair, then they should served NS too.

[Meanmachine]

Aiya... just let him go lah. No point wasting money to train him. Wait he become traitor to the country. Singapore passport very easy to get nowadays. One left, hundreds from china waiting to come and grab.

 

Before we let him go, must give him " blanket party ", let him taste NS life a bit . . . Selaki those PRC brother got wink of it and take advantage of the situation. How?

 

[Simontay55]

rightly said, not every thing is quantifiable.

 

regardless we go to top JC or ITE, we still serve NS.

 

i am quite sure that when we have boys, we know they will serve NS just like their dad do.

does that bring shame or pride in you?

 

[Simontay55]

there will always be people like darryn or darling around.

there will also be people who willingly, happily, eagerly came back to do NS before returning to whatever countries they were residing in. am not joking, have the pleasure to work with a few of them during NS.

 

it just simply reflect what kind of person you or your parents are.

[Darryn]

Darryn hasn't been through NS. not a personal attack or jibe at him, but I seem to remember that he's a PR from some other place (is it NEW ZEALAND?) and didn't have to serve due to age or whatsoever.

 

Anyone who has been through NS will not think like him.

 

Yep....my perspective is very very different to many around here.

 

You have all served, for which I doff my cap to you.

 

Which is also part of the reason why it's so important to get divergent views - in this sort of case there is no "wrong" or "right", it is a matter of what works for a country, and what you, as citizens, want to happen.

 

What is important here though is that you don't lock yourselves into a well, but that you get viewpoints from across the spectrum, and consider the merits and arguments before reaching a decision.

 

For what it's worth - I wanted to join my own country's armed forces as a regular, but was rejected due to poor eyesight. It was a career that I wanted and believe would have enjoyed. Unfortunately it was not to be.....(BTW - if it had happened I would right now be getting very close to retirement)

[Jokerd]

true. girls could also serve ns by working 2 years in hospital drawing an allowance, this way we could rely less on foreign nurses.

 

I have to admit I'm of 2 minds about this.

 

On 1 hand I think it's a good idea, on the other hand, I recall nightmares with the NSF nurses I had while in the SAF medical center especially when it comes to blood test or insertion of drips. I wonder if 2 years are enought to train them to do things.

[TVT]

To add, not only girls should do NS, but 1st generation PR too must serve, as long as they are below 40yrs old. Depending on their vocation, they will served in various vocations, not necessary in Mindef, can also in other Ministries, especially the Police force. This lets the PR applying have a sense of commitment in our country, not just come to "earn enough and go-back-&-retire"! After serving, they can opt to apply Citizenship or remain as a PR.

[Mustank]

with the Additional Buyer Stamp Duty, this guy will be begging to serve ns!