So wats so bad abt Diesel????

[Peaceracer]

I was wondering why is the Government so freaking harsh on diesel passenger cars?

 

I mean take a look at the New Audi A5 3.0 TDI. Price abt e same as A5 3.2 FSI, performance better, FC better, emissions better. But the diesel tax seems like its there to kill!!

 

It has already been proven that diesel's can now be as clean or even cleaner thn petrol and its more efficient as well. Aint Singapore being criticised for having too high a carbon footprint?

 

Can we have a petition or something to convince the gov abt this? Anyone knws wats going on in the gov's mind?

[Fcw75]

The only thing going on in the Govt mind is $$$ lor. Not difficult to figure out. The simple reason is they tax on petrol but not on diesel. So if everybody starts buying diesel passenger cars, where are they going to get the tax?

 

They can't possibly tax on diesel since it is used widely for businesses.

 

Petition? Hahaha....

 

 

[inlinesix]

I was wondering why is the Government so freaking harsh on diesel passenger cars?

 

I mean take a look at the New Audi A5 3.0 TDI. Price abt e same as A5 3.2 FSI, performance better, FC better, emissions better. But the diesel tax seems like its there to kill!!

 

It has already been proven that diesel's can now be as clean or even cleaner thn petrol and its more efficient as well. Aint Singapore being criticised for having too high a carbon footprint?

 

Can we have a petition or something to convince the gov abt this? Anyone knws wats going on in the gov's mind?

If u drive more than 30k km/yr, go ahead & buy. The saving in petrol is definitely able to offset against diesel surcharge.

[Peaceracer]

The only thing going on in the Govt mind is $$$ lor. Not difficult to figure out. The simple reason is they tax on petrol but not on diesel. So if everybody starts buying diesel passenger cars, where are they going to get the tax?

 

They can't possibly tax on diesel since it is used widely for businesses.

 

Petition? Hahaha....

 

Ya that went thru my mind too. Even if they make diesels the same price as say, petrol 92 and jus for passenger cars only, i would still think it would be a hit. Given diesels' superior torque and FC.

 

Jus wonder if they can work out a way to solving this. Think Europe will be shocked if they knw e situation in spore...

[Maroon5]

The only thing going on in the Govt mind is $$$ lor. Not difficult to figure out. The simple reason is they tax on petrol but not on diesel. So if everybody starts buying diesel passenger cars, where are they going to get the tax?

 

They can't possibly tax on diesel since it is used widely for businesses.

 

Petition? Hahaha....

 

and they will continue to feed us their logic...and we continue to LL...

[Rickster]

The reason is simple. Diesel is not taxed here unlike petrol.

 

So if govt encourage diesel, wouldn't it be as good as encouraging us to pay less $ to them.

 

U think they would do it? Or anyone in the right frame of mind would do that? [smash]

[Rickster]

If u drive more than 30k km/yr, go ahead & buy. The saving in petrol is definitely able to offset against diesel surcharge.

 

Unfortunately, the price of diesel cars available locally are simply [knife]

[Kotila]

Ya that went thru my mind too. Even if they make diesels the same price as say, petrol 92 and jus for passenger cars only, i would still think it would be a hit. Given diesels' superior torque and FC.

 

Jus wonder if they can work out a way to solving this. Think Europe will be shocked if they knw e situation in spore...

 

 

If diesels are not taxed, why is it about same price as petrol 92???????

 

[Picanto]

there is nothing bad about diesel. so many sonata taxis and buses on our island but our air quality is still very good.

 

i think its bad for the govt because they lose revenue from petrol if diesel cars are allowed. that's why the diesel tax on cars is very high.

 

its all about the $$$.

[Gbsm]

Side track a bit.. What abt the tax if its a diesel OPC drive..?

[Mustank]

petition for what

 

for me, i just buy van buy pig karp, problem solved

[Doosan]

being ex-british colonial/straits settlement, we hv inherited almost every thing passed/handed down by our previous master, n hence very unlikely to change, especially taxation/custom duty etc r concerned

 

iirc, lately article in forum abt "tekkok"=german 4OOO+cc diesel car, if reg as passenger car, road tax xptd to be some thing like $3-4K/yr. in order to break-even, owner had to travell maybe like taxi.

 

but in old day, dieseline was cheap, so gov charges higer road tax to offset diff wit gasoline prices.

almost a yr ago, dieseline in gas stn was retail at ard 1.7O??

so it doesnt make sense to charge higher rd tax

 

with current diesel engine tech, euro4 envr compliance, it shd be time to adj rd tax structure for diesel propelled pax cars

 

even the huge van tat i'm currently driving, wit single rear wheel, clsaa 3 licence only.

tis is bcos van is 8Okg below rules stipulated

it seems the size of van doesnt counts, so long as bare weight meets reqmt.

 

for safety/better stability, 1ce if it is fitted wit twin rear wheels, most likely the bare weight of van gets heavier, in which class 4 licence is required.

 

some times jz wondering, even goods veh oso needs to bid for coe

[W210k]

I was wondering why is the Government so freaking harsh on diesel passenger cars?

 

I mean take a look at the New Audi A5 3.0 TDI. Price abt e same as A5 3.2 FSI, performance better, FC better, emissions better. But the diesel tax seems like its there to kill!!

 

It has already been proven that diesel's can now be as clean or even cleaner thn petrol and its more efficient as well. Aint Singapore being criticised for having too high a carbon footprint?

 

Can we have a petition or something to convince the gov abt this? Anyone knws wats going on in the gov's mind?

 

That's what the likes of VAG (VW, Audi et al) and some other European car manufacturers would like you to believe.

 

Clean fuel is not just about CO2 emissions only. For this, on a fuel-burnt per km basis, diesel engines may be better than gasoline engines. Not sure about SOx and NOx though - since chemically, current low-sulfur diesel will emit more SOx and NOx than gasoline.

 

BUT (and that's a big but) in addition to gaseous emissions .... diesel engines' particulate matter (PM) emission is far worse than a gasoline engine's (due to a higher poly-nuclear aromatics and con-carbon residue number, than compared to gasoline). That is what VAG et all has not been very open about, in their push for more diesel cars to be put on the road. This last point is exactly what the Singapore Govt's concern is based on - PM emissions. And for this, I fully support the Government on the push-back and the country's stand on the matter.

 

But all countries environmental agencies (like NEA in SG) know about this and are thus applying the necessary back-pressure not to have more diesel cars on their roads. Particulates in the air is already a bane in cities like Bangkok and Manila, leading to hazy sick-looking skies. Singapore will never want to be in that quagmire.

 

Australia is also getting a lot of similar pressure from companies like VAG to pull the stop on diesel cars. But like Singapore, the Australian government will likely raise diesel taxes even more, in order to allow VAG to introduce diesel models in the Oz showrooms. The irony of it all, much to the disdain of VAG of course. The reason is simple: "diesel fuel is more polluting" - that came from Australia, not me.

 

And it will be a long long time, maybe even never, for the USA (the largest automobile market in the world) to adopt such a policy (its vehicular fuel being strongly entrenched on gasoline). Similarly for South America, especially countries like Brazil where alcohol-gasoline (aka gasohols) is firmly entrenched due to its agricultural bias.

 

I cannot imagine how bad the LA smogs will be (bad as they are already), if diesel is legislated to be the norm for passenger cars in California. You would see even more highway pileups on the California freeways during a smog - as it is, you cannot see even 10m and beyond! Particulate matter from diesel fuel can and will only worsen the situation.

 

Thailand has introduced gasohols too, over the past couple of years. So will the states of Queensland and New South Wales in Australia, by 2011.

 

So this diesel push is IMHO, only a European phenomenon. Thus it is in VAG's vested interest to build mainly (better still, only) diesel engine cars for the non-USA market - and that includes all right-hand drive countries like Australia, Singapore, HongKong, Japan etc. Otherwise, they will need to build only right-hand drives diesel cars for the relatively 'small' UK market. No economies of scale. All for their own 'selfish' business interests.

 

p.s. I have a colleague in Scotland who after calculating consumption vs tax savings and all, still drives a petrol-driven car. His rationale is that the distance he travels to work (in a petrochemical plant) and back will not breakeven the diesel tax reliefs in place in the UK. For diesel to 'work', there has to be a breakeven minimum distance travelled. So even in the UK, it is not a 100% given that diesel cars are compatible with users' pockets.

 

For us, our families, our children and childrens' children, I agree fully with the Singapore Government's stand on diesel cars. We need to limit its use for purely commercial reasons. TDI engines and their equivalent notwithstanding, since these turbo-diesels' efficiency will quickly go south after a few years and be back to being worse off than a EURO5 gasoline engine. It only 'looks' good on paper CO2 when brand new, but still off on PM, SOx and NOx (even when brand new).

 

So screw the European car manufacturers for their selfish, vest interests, embedded with ulterior motives of the monetary kind.

Edited July 24, 2009 by W210k

[Peaceracer]

If diesels are not taxed, why is it about same price as petrol 92???????

 

 

Wat i meant was that if they wanna tax (cos they want $$) and make the price of diesel for cars to be $1.67/litre(same as petrol 92), diesels will still be a hit due to its superior torque and FC.

[Peaceracer]

petition for what

 

for me, i just buy van buy pig karp, problem solved

 

Don knw lehz, maybe the gov scared that spore demand for diesel not very high. If we show them tat alot of us are for diesels, they could relax the taxation so they earn from quantity instead?

 

Something like - instead of selling 1 ferrari earn 100k, they can sell 10 hyundai and earn 10k each.

[Peaceracer]

Hmmm, your statement is a fresh side of the story i was never exposed to....

[W210k]

Hmmm, your statement is a fresh side of the story i was never exposed to....

 

Its OK bro, you're not in the oil and petrochem industry.

 

[Beehive3783]

hmm.. since this is the case, i wonder why the EU is not doing anything?