Property

[Karoon]

 

actually the high price for ec now is a side effect of the "cannot sell open area to owner rule" (be careful what one wish for! )

 

old rule:

all along Govt give 20% bonus open space to developer. then deevelopers sell these open space as balcony, patio, roof terrace, bay window, to owner at a reduced price. that is why if a unit has massive amount of open space, then the psf is low. These open space helps to reduce psf per unit, while the developer still can earn.

 

new rule:

now Govt say that if developer sells these open space to owner, developper has to pay marnie to Govt. so developer lan lan, now use all these 20% bonus free open space as communual space, such as a giant roof garden. But developer got earn some marnie from selling open space in old rule. By building a giant roof garden in scenario 2, they dont get any any marnie. So how to maintain the profits as per old rule? raise the psf of new rule lor!

 

conclusion: this is why the condos are affected by the new rule has a higher psf

basically each unit's balcony/patio/roof terrace (in old rule) had just transformed and merge into the commnual giant roof terrace (as in new rule). somemore the psf add another 20%

 

thanks for the clarification....

 

also, as we speak...

 

18 Nov 2013

 

 

To provide developers and home-buyers with more choices for private housing, the Housing & Development Board (HDB) and the Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) will be releasing four residential sites for sale in November 2013 under the Government Land Sales (GLS) Programme for the second half of 2013 (2H2013). The residential site at Upper Paya Lebar Road and two Executive Condominium sites at Canberra Drive and Anchorvale Crescent are launched for sale today under the Confirmed List. The Executive Condominium site at Choa Chu Kang Drive is made available for application today on the Reserve List. - See more at: http://business.asiaone.com/property/news/singapore-sell-4-residential-sites-nov#sthash.vAJ83RJa.dpuf

 

 

 

 

so I was wrong, the URA list of EC plots was just for those already auctioned off....

there's still few more in the pipeline

[Staff69]

Very good read. Much better than just cursing and swearing one liners

[Lala81]

Lol all the big balconies plus double AC ledges just amuse me to no end. my 2 sqm AC ledge can fit 2 compressors. i dunno why need 2 AC ledges for one house...

[Lala81]

 

actually the high price for ec now is a side effect of the "cannot sell open area to owner rule" (be careful what one wish for! )

 

old rule:

all along Govt give 20% bonus open space to developer. then deevelopers sell these open space as balcony, patio, roof terrace, bay window, to owner at a reduced price. that is why if a unit has massive amount of open space, then the psf is low. These open space helps to reduce psf per unit, while the developer still can earn.

 

new rule:

now Govt say that if developer sells these open space to owner, developper has to pay marnie to Govt. so developer lan lan, now use all these 20% bonus free open space as communual space, such as a giant roof garden. But developer got earn some marnie from selling open space in old rule. By building a giant roof garden in scenario 2, they dont get any any marnie. So how to maintain the profits as per old rule? raise the psf of new rule lor!

 

conclusion: this is why the condos are affected by the new rule has a higher psf

basically each unit's balcony/patio/roof terrace (in old rule) had just transformed and merge into the commnual giant roof terrace (as in new rule). somemore the psf add another 20%

 

are balconies affected? or only PES?

 

This skypark still has big balcony + super lot of AC ledges ...

[Mustank]

 

are balconies affected? or only PES?

 

This skypark still has big balcony + super lot of AC ledges ...

 

balcony is the confirm kena one

i donnot whether the ac ledges counted under the 20% free from Govt or not.......

[Wt_know]

old rule, new rule, future rule .... developer only has one objective which is to make money ... lots and lots of money

whether to build one giant communal space or sell "emtpy space" at reduced price ... buyer has to foot the bill

 

govt make money

developer make money

investor make money

 

live in owner pay money ... the more they can borrow ... the more they had to pay up

 

when the borrowing stop ... the crazy price will stop

till then ... huat ah!!!

 

seriously, i won't blame the developer. they can bid $1000psf for the land and sell $1500psf to buyer

it's the buyer that take sky high loan to finance the pigeon hole condo

then govt will kaypoh ... "asset rich, cash poor"

 

taking an international affordability benchmark of property = 5x yearly income

$1M = $200K income per annum

in spore $1M condo is considered mass market ... mostly <1000sqft

all these units sell like hot cakes

which mean every soul you see enter the showroom are earning $200k per annum and nothing less

if you divide by 2 person = $100k / 12 months = $8300 = this is the minimum salary per head

Edited November 18, 2013 by Wt_know

[Karoon]

old rule, new rule, future rule .... developer only has one objective which is to make money ... lots and lots of money

whether to build one giant communal space or sell "emtpy space" at reduced price ... buyer has to foot the bill

 

govt make money

developer make money

investor make money

 

live in owner pay money ... the more they can borrow ... the more they had to pay up

 

when the borrowing stop ... the crazy price will stop

till then ... huat ah!!!

 

seriously, i won't blame the developer. they can bid $1000psf for the land and sell $1500psf to buyer

it's the buyer that take sky high loan to finance the pigeon hole condo

then govt will kaypoh ... "asset rich, cash poor"

 

taking an international affordability benchmark of property = 5x yearly income

$1M = $200K income per annum

in spore $1M condo is considered mass market ... mostly <1000sqft

all these units sell like hot cakes

which mean every soul you see enter the showroom are earning $200k per annum and nothing less

if you divide by 2 person = $100k / 12 months = $8300 = this is the minimum salary per head

 

lots of very rational voices on this forum

[Kangadrool]

Lol all the big balconies plus double AC ledges just amuse me to no end. my 2 sqm AC ledge can fit 2 compressors. i dunno why need 2 AC ledges for one house...

Preparing for more global warming coming...... Our garment has very good foresight de.

[Knight]

 

hey guys i'm jumping into this thread to get your views on property....

 

I'm happily married, stay in 5 room, spacious old hdb.

The best things I like are the unobstructed view, as we face a lake, and the loan is fully repaid

Wife not working and looking after our kids.

 

Recently I got itchy backside, and realising I could still qualify for EC (barely), I went to look at the new EC launches.

 

I was surprised at a few things....

 

1) The crowd flocking there like its something given out FOC

2) The price .... $750/psf and above, meaning $1m and above for 4 bedrooms...

3) The proximity of the apartments, mostly facing inwards towards the pool, and each other, with full floor to ceiling glass walls (no more looking out to the horizon, just your neighbours' hall and bedroom). Even the ones facing exterior are facing future developments, and no guarantee of open views.

 

I almost, almost bought one unit on impulse, ready to give my cheque, but excused myself for a breather..... and drove straight home... *phew*

 

If you have a good, rare though old hdb unit, would you sell it and upgrade to EC with no view, stuck in it for at least 8 years (3 years to TOP + 5 years minimum occupation period before you can sell) and get into debt again (probably for half a mil after selling off HDB)

 

Or would you hold on to your hdb, buy a pte condo when the market dips (with additional 7% Additional Buyer Stamp Duty for 2nd property, retain half of cpf minimum sum in OA etc etc) and rent out your hdb. As its pte condo, easier to sell off, and move back to my hdb should I wish.

 

I'm worried about debt as for sure interest rates will be back at a high by 2016 (i'm in finance related job)...... think lots of people will be in trouble at this point, especially EC dwellers.... imagine buying a $1m property when your combined income is below $12k. I strongly believe property price correction is due then...

 

Also, people keep saying buying an EC is an investment, but is that so?

It depends on which cycle you're at, and this is one helluva peak.

 

And I will miss the heavenly feeling of being debt free :(

 

From all the points you made, it would appear what you have preferred

You have the answers inside and seeking assurance from supporting views here

 

 

[Karoon]

 

From all the points you made, it would appear what you have preferred

You have the answers inside and seeking assurance from supporting views here

 

 

 

perhaps....

 

but also not ruling out being swayed by strong arguments on the pros....

[Knight]

 

From all the points you made, it would appear what you have preferred

You have the answers inside and seeking assurance from supporting views here

 

 

 

Many still wishing for a crash

Another Lehman Brothers crash scenario is unlikely to happen -- as all the mechanisms are in place to prevent this

 

What's the RISK

A default by US or one of the Euro governments?

Will this cause a collapse? -- not likely, because they are printing their way out BUT they may end up selling their national assets

And most likely China (incl Singapore) is ready on hand ..... to buy into them

 

How about Risk from China?

Local governments may be over-geared? Are figures reported by banks truly reflective?

Yes, these are concerns. But the Central government is a Strong regulator - it does not need to consult and does not need to give grace. In this regulatory environment, any potential problem can be resolved quickly PLUS the Central government is financially VERY powerful

 

Just sharing personal thoughts

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Knight]

Why buy EC?

Although high popularity doesn't mean it's the best, EC does have LOTS of merit

 

- 1st time applicants can apply grant upto 30k (this is savings)

- 2nd time applicants don't need to pay resale levy (this is savings)
- According to media reports, most launch prices are 25-30% lower than condos of similar location (this is savings)

If one is looking for Condo lifestyle and wants a BIG place to stay, is there another option other than EC?

 

Should Property Planning start from young? Or wait till 45? 55?
- should you buy BTO, then Condo later?
- should you buy EC?

 

Do you prefer a conservative or aggressive approach?
Do you prefer a balanced one?

There is no universally right answer, property planning is a personal CHOICE

And with all choices, you reap the consequences

The only PERFECT plan is to rewind the clock

... Just personal thoughts

Edited November 18, 2013 by Knight

[Wt_know]

crash? very highly unlikely

 

emergency brake already put in place to avoid crash

even crash come ... they can kick the can down the road ... music continues

 

usa is high on qe and raising debt ceiling

imagine stop qe and do not allow to raise debt ceiling is like pushing the patient out of ER ... die immediately

 

europe is high on bailout ... living on bailout-to-bailout year-to-year

thanks to the euro currency, one country fall affect all ... so die die must bailout

 

china is high on sustaining gdp above 7.5%

india is high on growing domestic economy

Edited November 19, 2013 by Wt_know

[Wt_know]

i recognise that external factors and world economy do have impact on property price

but ... local factor is the MAJOR influence to property price

demand and supply

 

demand ... can open floodgate, can remove CM, can reduce sales of land, can change policy, can do many many things

supply ... can up/down BTO & EC projects, can increase/decrease land sales, can also do many many things

local policy changes and CM has direct impact on property price rather than usa/europe collapse or lehman brother collapse

 

even world economy tank to bottom ... if govt step in ... govt can "stablise" the property price

you think govt will let property price free fall and crash?

Edited November 19, 2013 by Wt_know

[Enye]

crash? very highly unlikely

 

emergency brake already put in place to avoid crash

even crash come ... they can kick the can down the road ... music continues

 

usa is high on qe and raising debt ceiling

imagine stop qe and do not allow to raise debt ceiling is like pushing the patient out of ER ... die immediately

 

europe is high on bailout ... living on bailout-to-bailout year-to-year

thanks to the euro currency, one country fall affect all ... so die die must bailout

 

china is high on sustaining gdp above 7.5%

india is high on growing domestic economy

 

you still believe in the China and India growth fairy tale?

 

the next phase of growth will likely come from developed countries

 

but they have to get past the current difficulties first

 

when that happens, the liquidity will flow back to their own countries

 

meanwhile, the world would just muddle along

 

[Wt_know]

i don't believe in china/india "rapid" growth fairy tale

but i do believe china/india need to "sustain" their gdp in order to keep the country floating

if gdp fall below certain point (ie: <5%) ... all hell break lose for the 2 largest nation in the world

Edited November 19, 2013 by Wt_know

[Enye]

i don't believe in china/india "rapid" growth fairy tale

but i do believe china/india need to "sustain" their gdp in order to keep the country floating

if gdp fall below certain point (ie: <5%) ... all hell break lose for the 2 largest nation in the world

 

then you have to hope that their "sustainable" gdp growth figures are true figures and not massaged data, which they are well known for

 

in the latter case, the crash will be highly unexpected and will drag the whole world down to hell together

 

[Wt_know]

yup ... they are damn good in massaging data and building ghost town and mega shopping mall with fake brands

on the contrary, i believe china got plenty of $$$ to burn for the next 5-10 years

and china has not start their $printer$ like usa yet ...

Edited November 19, 2013 by Wt_know