Pastor

[Felipe]

those followers are really hopeless liao. Follow blindly...... i think even if verdict come out that both are guilty, they will not accept it. Sekali they go out on the street to protest

$2m to defend? It'll be CAD vs CHC.

[Darryn]

You brought up some important points. If CHC is guilty, I'm sure that person who brought up the case initially would be interviewed again and would say he feels vindicated or simply 'I told you so'.

 

Now seriously, he was just an ordinary member in the church whose business was not even doing well. He had to pay several thousand dollars to publish the apology letter, of which he could not even afford and a friend had to help him through it. Obviously when the public read the apology in the papers, they would assume he made false accusations. But what else could he have done? With no hard evidence and of course, loads of money to burn, the only way out was to issue an apology. I'm not saying he had evidence to begin with, but I think it was pretty clear he stopped the minute the lawyers came into the picture. In short, you don't fight someone when you don't have the ammunition and he paid a hefty price for his actions.

 

The result was an apology plus forgiveness from the church. Obviously again, what else the church could have done other than to forgive him? After all, they preach forgiveness although I'm not so sure whether he is still in that church.

 

Fast forward to today, some smart aleck/s complained to COC instead of going straight to the press. In this way, lawyers cannot direct their attention on powerless ppl and I'm quite sure they wouldn't want to try their luck on COC or CAD to issue apologies. The lesson one can learn is if you don't have the ammunition, get those who have, to do the fighting for you.

 

I'm in two minds about it. While I hate to see unsubstaniated accusations being thrown around, and trial by media totally sucks, there is a massive power disparity here.

 

An organisation (whether it be chruch or whatever) has much much greater resources than an individual. At the same time, while an indiviual may smell a bad smell, how does he gather evidence? He does not have access to accounts or whatever (and nor should he) but this doesn't negate that there may be something smelly happening.

 

Sometimes if the issue is raised in public, then more people can come forward with pieces of the puzzle. At the same time, by allowing the issue to be raised, you are informing the organisation supporters that all is not neccessarily as the owners present.

 

I am also of the opinion that if you put yourself forward in the public sphere as a public figure you are inviting comment and discussion, so if people say something about you, they should be held to a lower standard of slander / libel / defamation.

[Damienic]

I found the comments from a CHC member friend:

 

FYI: In 2003, Ho broke into Hollywood with her debut American single

[Tigerwoods]

It is when you could get a car the same size that will perform the same function for half the price....

 

The CLS is $70++, she could have had a Taurus or Accord for around $25++.

 

The 50k....how much must a family tithe and sacrifice to do that much money?

 

What is she sacrificing? That is "only" driving a CLS instead of a Mulsanne?

It seems many of you are extremely Judgemental to this woman. Just because she is the wife of a Pastor.

Everyone of you judges her with a very very long Ruler.

 

I'm no supporter of this church or the pastor but I cannot judge her by the High lifestyle. Who are ALL of us to make immediate verdict that she puts her hand in the Church Till ?

 

Being a Celebrity in US, you drive a Hyundai Avante and stay in cheap houses ? Then you are not even in that league. Sometimes you have to live that lifestyle to be in the Network of Showbiz - its sad but true.

 

I won't want to cast that 1st STONE at her or her Pastor Husband. It seems Most of you have already threw a few ROCKS...

 

Stop Judging people - look and examine yourselves instead.

[Jman888]

It seems many of you are extremely Judgemental to this woman. Just because she is the wife of a Pastor.

Everyone of you judges her with a very very long Ruler.

 

I won't want to cast that 1st STONE at her or her Pastor Husband. It seems Most of you have already threw a few ROCKS...

 

Stop Judging people - look and examine yourselves instead.

 

if she live in a high life knowing the husband lead a 30k members church, a lot of people will be judging and they better don't be there if they can't take the pressure of been judged!

 

sometime it is questions and doubt that people has and judging is a form of speculating and assuming for these questions.

[Lightbringer]

Thanks kind sir.

 

But just a quick side note - I don't have religious inclination, I do not worship nor attened church. I am not Christian and have never been Christened or Baptized or anything.....

 

That explains a lot, really. And there I was wondering yesterday if I had came across a fabled creature that previously only existed in myths and folklore. Must have mistaken you for somebody else ;)

[Lightbringer]

Hee...I have been talking about this with a Facebook friend who works with a CHC member..

 

He makes comments like

"You know we have lots of rich members, we don't care about the claims"

or

"You know how much reserves we have - it doesn't matter that Sun live in such expensive house, even if the church is supporting"

or

"We have four ATM in Church, you think we don't have money?"

 

Strikes me as very "face" based and "howlian" rather than genuine worship...

 

makes me all to hear this sort of wrong headed claptrap....

 

I actually find all of such remarks rather fitting and appropriate coming from a CHC member. It takes a certain kind of person, of a particular moral persuasion and character, to be brainwashed and taken in by the prosperity gospel. And this fellow, my friend, is representative of all that CHC stands for.

 

What does a pile of dung attracts?

[Altivo]

interesting allegations in the Asiaone forum.

 

Seems like part of the tithe which was meant for the building fund was channelled to a MPF - multi purpose fund which was then usd for other purposes other than the original intended purpose... all w/o the knowlege of the contributors.

 

Now some CHC members are questioning if the MPF was used to support horsey's lifesylte in US

Edited June 22, 2010 by Altivo

[Lightbringer]

Why someone seek to be a pastor if he is not seeking the extreme? The fully devoted to God and possibility to be a saint.

 

Except in this case "God" refers to wealth and material assets? LOL.

[Felipe]

It seems many of you are extremely Judgemental to this woman. Just because she is the wife of a Pastor.

Everyone of you judges her with a very very long Ruler.

 

I'm no supporter of this church or the pastor but I cannot judge her by the High lifestyle. Who are ALL of us to make immediate verdict that she puts her hand in the Church Till ?

 

Being a Celebrity in US, you drive a Hyundai Avante and stay in cheap houses ? Then you are not even in that league. Sometimes you have to live that lifestyle to be in the Network of Showbiz - its sad but true.

 

I won't want to cast that 1st STONE at her or her Pastor Husband. It seems Most of you have already threw a few ROCKS...

 

Stop Judging people - look and examine yourselves instead.

I won't go as far as to say she's a celebrity in the US yet, but she is clearly trying to be one. Normally, you don't live the high life till you're a celebrity. You also don't live a high life to be a celebrity. It's more like you work to be a celebrity to live the high life instead.

 

As for judging Sun, i agree it's not proper to accuse her of taking money from the church as there's no evidence of that. On the other hand, it's an ethical issue where the lifestyle does not reflect the message. It doesn't take a genius to understand that. But I won't be surprise some ppl find it hard to understand.

[Felipe]

I actually find all of such remarks rather fitting and appropriate coming from a CHC member. It takes a certain kind of person, of a particular moral persuasion and character, to be brainwashed and taken in by the prosperity gospel. And this fellow, my friend, is representative of all that CHC stands for.

 

What does a pile of dung attracts?

Absolutely, even Hitler has his legion of fans till today.

[Acemundo]

i agree. it is like using a car to bully a bicycle.

 

i always find it unfair that organizations bully individuals this way. like you said, i always feel that public figure or organization should tolerate a higher level of accusations made by individuals as compared to those made by another public figure or organzation.

Edited June 22, 2010 by Acemundo

[Lightbringer]

I have actually attended a few of the "Business Breakthrough Group" meetings hosted by the business elites among the CHC congregation just to see what were up to.

 

You will be surprised at how they explicitly linked the sub-prime crisis and possibly every other financial disaster to the "plan of God". What was pretty scary was how the "leaders" of this particular group was exhorting their fellow "brothers and sisters" to convert their cash and financial instrument holdings into commodities and resource-based assets such as mines, farms, etc..... so as to control the flow of resources when "Armageddon" comes and to seize power in the aftermath, where such commodities will become the true wealth and currency will become worthless.

 

If this isn't alarming, I don't know what is.

[Kingcopa]

I have actually attended a few of the "Business Breakthrough Group" meetings hosted by the business elites among the CHC congregation just to see what were up to.

 

You will be surprised at how they explicitly linked the sub-prime crisis and possibly every other financial disaster to the "plan of God". What was pretty scary was how the "leaders" of this particular group was exhorting their fellow "brothers and sisters" to convert their cash and financial instrument holdings into commodities and resource-based assets such as mines, farms, etc..... so as to control the flow of resources when "Armageddon" comes and to seize power in the aftermath, where such commodities will become the true wealth and currency will become worthless.

 

If this isn't alarming, I don't know what is.

Kena poison too much. Like Cult like that.

[Lightbringer]

Kena poison too much. Like Cult like that.

 

You will be surprised at what public figures and celebrities I spotted at the meetings. Quite an eye-opener, I must say.

 

All the "soulful singing" and calls to open your heart to the lordddddd made my hair stand up a little though.

[Kingcopa]

You will be surprised at what public figures and celebrities I spotted at the meetings. Quite an eye-opener, I must say.

 

All the "soulful singing" and calls to open your heart to the lordddddd made my hair stand up a little though.

did anyone rush up to the stage n kneel down and cry out "Yes God I accept u in my life" Hand wide open, eyes close... machiam like Taoist Tankee like that. see liao aso scared.

[Lightbringer]

did anyone rush up to the stage n kneel down and cry out "Yes God I accept u in my life" Hand wide open, eyes close... machiam like Taoist Tankee like that. see liao aso scared.

 

Don't have... we're talking about die-hard converts here... and they're mostly the higher-echelon members in the congregation..... not your usual bunch of Ah Lians and Ah Huays. Haha.

 

BUT eh! Now I do recall many of them doing exactly that - hand wide open, eyes closed, rocking back and forth, singing with great emotion.... hahaha.

Edited June 22, 2010 by Lightbringer

[Kingcopa]

Don't have... we're talking about die-hard converts here... and they're mostly the higher-echelon members in the congregation..... not your usual bunch of Ah Lians and Ah Huays. Haha.

 

BUT eh! Now I do recall many of them doing exactly that - hand wide open, eyes closed, rocking back and forth, singing with great emotion.... hahaha.

Just like those tan kee when u go taoist temple right