Middle class blues

[Mustank]

The reason we need to import so much cheap labour is

that there is no financial incentive for companies to replace

cheap labour with investments in automation and innovation.

 

Take service and construction, they are still using the same old

labour intensive methods that were used 20 years ago.

Where is the improvements in productivity?

 

Companies need to discard the short term view but why

should they when the flood gates for cheap labour is wide open.

 

As for people that say - Singaporeans only want white collar jobs.

Thats very true and lets not be hypocrites, if they really think blue

collar jobs are so fantastic then let their children do it.

 

Or are the people that saying this also pushing their kids to do well

in school so that they also get white collar jobs?

 

 

 

[Mustank]

The people that always tell us how rich they are and

 

always look down on others who are not so well off

 

tell us not to lose ourselves in the process.

 

These people need to follow their own very good advice.

 

Or are they really too lost to see? I hope not.

 

 

JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!! JAMES!!!!

[Somewhat1975]

Many people hate the FTs for taking away our jobs and lowering the wage levels, are not understanding the big picture. The cruel truth is, we need them. Look at other countries, which one is not taking in foreign workers ? More than a decade ago, when i worked in united states in a very large world wide organisation, many of the professional level workers were from all over the world, china, india, sgp, hong kong .. you name it. People only see the problem the influx of ft brought along, but they fail to realise that, we have no choice. back then our population was too small to sustain our economy and if not for the ft policy, wages wil be driven up high artificially (and not due to producitivity but labour crunch), and we will lose out in competitiveness to the rest of the world. result will be our economy will experience negative growth and companies shut down, people lose job. so for the bigger good, we had to go for the necessary evil, i.e. to take in FTs , so as to enjoy a bigger economic pie in the world. It is a painful measure but it ensured our progress for years.

 

you talked like wage is the only business cost. Import of foreign workers drove down the wage. Business owner started to have more profit. Then the landlord asked for a higher rent and take away any extra profit the business owner made. This is especially true in Singapore where the available space for business is limited. Thus import of foreign worker just transfer the wealth from the worker to the landlord. It is not surprised that the period of stagnant wage in the past ten years in Singapore coincided with the period of rapid raising rent.

[Mustank]

you talked like wage is the only business cost. Import of foreign workers drove down the wage. Business owner started to have more profit. Then the landlord asked for a higher rent and take away any extra profit the business owner made. This is especially true in Singapore where the available space for business is limited. Thus import of foreign worker just transfer the wealth from the worker to the landlord. It is not surprised that the period of stagnant wage in the past ten years in Singapore coincided with the period of rapid raising rent.

 

 

UP for you!!!

[VolksBarSG]

Many people hate the FTs for taking away our jobs and lowering the wage levels, are not understanding the big picture. The cruel truth is, we need them. Look at other countries, which one is not taking in foreign workers ? More than a decade ago, when i worked in united states in a very large world wide organisation, many of the professional level workers were from all over the world, china, india, sgp, hong kong .. you name it. People only see the problem the influx of ft brought along, but they fail to realise that, we have no choice. back then our population was too small to sustain our economy and if not for the ft policy, wages wil be driven up high artificially (and not due to producitivity but labour crunch), and we will lose out in competitiveness to the rest of the world. result will be our economy will experience negative growth and companies shut down, people lose job. so for the bigger good, we had to go for the necessary evil, i.e. to take in FTs , so as to enjoy a bigger economic pie in the world. It is a painful measure but it ensured our progress for years.

 

You're missing the point lah bro. We have TOO many. Yes, FT is good IN MODERATION. Right now we have too many, and they are kicking out locals from jobs, leading to a mass jobless rate amongst locals. FTs can run anywhere they want because they are not anchored to this country, but locals cannot what. Tio tied down by reservist, HDB flat and relatives, and cost of living going up up and up while the purchasing power of their salaries going down down and down. How? You tell me how we are not 'understanding the big picture' lah.

[Mustank]

You're missing the point lah bro. We have TOO many. Yes, FT is good IN MODERATION. Right now we have too many, and they are kicking out locals from jobs, leading to a mass jobless rate amongst locals. FTs can run anywhere they want because they are not anchored to this country, but locals cannot what. Tio tied down by reservist, HDB flat and relatives, and cost of living going up up and up while the purchasing power of their salaries going down down and down. How? You tell me how we are not 'understanding the big picture' lah.

 

[13177]

You're missing the point lah bro. We have TOO many. Yes, FT is good IN MODERATION. Right now we have too many, and they are kicking out locals from jobs, leading to a mass jobless rate amongst locals. FTs can run anywhere they want because they are not anchored to this country, but locals cannot what. Tio tied down by reservist, HDB flat and relatives, and cost of living going up up and up while the purchasing power of their salaries going down down and down. How? You tell me how we are not 'understanding the big picture' lah.

Agreed, nothing against FTs but if too many of them then become no good liao. Some of the jobs here confirm locals can do, example like those executive/engineer but i noticed many companies even get FTs to do such job?! Dont tell me no locals want to do these jobs?

[Viceroymenthol]

You're missing the point lah bro. We have TOO many. Yes, FT is good IN MODERATION. Right now we have too many, and they are kicking out locals from jobs, leading to a mass jobless rate amongst locals. FTs can run anywhere they want because they are not anchored to this country, but locals cannot what. Tio tied down by reservist, HDB flat and relatives, and cost of living going up up and up while the purchasing power of their salaries going down down and down. How? You tell me how we are not 'understanding the big picture' lah.

 

How many is "too many"? How many is "moderation"?? Is moderation the perfect balance when all local PMETs, barring none, hold middle to high corporate positions, earn $20k a month salaries, drive contis and live in private condos?

 

Talk c0ck lah.

[Scion]

Many people hate the FTs for taking away our jobs and lowering the wage levels, are not understanding the big picture. The cruel truth is, we need them. Look at other countries, which one is not taking in foreign workers ? More than a decade ago, when i worked in united states in a very large world wide organisation, many of the professional level workers were from all over the world, china, india, sgp, hong kong .. you name it. People only see the problem the influx of ft brought along, but they fail to realise that, we have no choice. back then our population was too small to sustain our economy and if not for the ft policy, wages wil be driven up high artificially (and not due to producitivity but labour crunch), and we will lose out in competitiveness to the rest of the world. result will be our economy will experience negative growth and companies shut down, people lose job. so for the bigger good, we had to go for the necessary evil, i.e. to take in FTs , so as to enjoy a bigger economic pie in the world. It is a painful measure but it ensured our progress for years.

 

you the same as govt

 

we already repeat this until sian

 

we need FWs for our construction, F&B, garbage clearing, shipyard, etc, but not the overflowing of those foreign PMETs (aka FTs)

[Viceroymenthol]

but not the overflowing of those foreign PMETs (aka FTs)

 

Why not?

 

Are you absolutely sure that Singaporeans can do the jobs that these FTs do?

[VolksBarSG]

How many is "too many"? How many is "moderation"?? Is moderation the perfect balance when all local PMETs, barring none, hold middle to high corporate positions, earn $20k a month salaries, drive contis and live in private condos?

 

Talk c0ck lah.

 

You PAP IB isit...might as well ask me if I want my meals in a hawker centre, a food court or restaurant lah.

 

Moderation means that no local PMETs have to be retrenched in order for these foreigners to have a job. Moderation is when all the local PMETs all have jobs and the FTs can also have jobs without displacing any locals. Understand not?

[VolksBarSG]

Why not?

 

Are you absolutely sure that Singaporeans can do the jobs that these FTs do?

 

Why do you think our local unis all offering courses that all these FTs are doing?

[Viceroymenthol]

You PAP IB isit...might as well ask me if I want my meals in a hawker centre, a food court or restaurant lah.

 

Moderation means that no local PMETs have to be retrenched in order for these foreigners to have a job. Moderation is when all the local PMETs all have jobs and the FTs can also have jobs without displacing any locals. Understand not?

 

Even when the local PMET is a lazy good for nothing stupid idiot, cannot think, cannot talk properly, cannot write properly, cannot do work? I am sure we have all met these PMETs some time or another and we are left scratching our heads wondering how this idiot ever graduated from university.

 

You know what you will end up with?

 

Something like the Bumiputera policy. When even incompetent fools are guaranteed a job by virtue of their birth.

[Solar]

despite so many years into this immigration for talent/workers thingy, imo our mom is still not mature yet.

look at how australia deals with theirs.

 

in addition to a quota of immigrants approved per year, they have reviews every 6 months and adjust their jobs-in-demand list, and this list is a result of feedback and discussion with the industry's needs where they could not find locals for the job.

they also have professional bodies there to ascertain that certain trade is qualified and have the right experience in their field to weed out fakes.

example of professionals are nurses, doctors, mining, oil/rig-related professionals, and trades like plumbers and hair-dressers.

IT managers used to be on that list.. then was later removed.

 

mom is not transparent...perhaps don't even have this list available?

[Viceroymenthol]

Why do you think our local unis all offering courses that all these FTs are doing?

 

 

If you have worked in global MNCs before, you will understand that paper qualifications are just a formality. What matters most is the competency and quality of the employee himself, and this can be somewhat gauged through interviews.

 

Just because some four-eyed local nerd ace'd his local uni exam papers doesn't mean squat if he is not the right fit for the company and culture.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Viceroymenthol

[VolksBarSG]

If you have worked in global MNCs before, you will understand that paper qualifications are just a formality. What matters most is the competency and quality of the employee himself, and this can be somewhat gauged through interviews.

 

Just because some four-eyed local nerd ace'd his local uni exam papers doesn't mean squat if he is not the right fit for the company and culture.

 

Correct, but you asked if 'can do' mah. Of course can lah, but with bosses with your kind of mindset where got chance to prove it?

[Solar]

Why not?

 

Are you absolutely sure that Singaporeans can do the jobs that these FTs do?

 

on this one.. we just fired one myanmar network 'consultant' from our project..

it was during the solutioning that he was found to be just a mediocre, only done some simple network support work.

half the time don't understand what the client said/wanted.

 

immediately we told the network department to send us another guy.

 

then another guy was sent in.. this time could better understand the requirement and came out with the network design in a few days.

 

so the question is, why this myanmmar guy got into sg and got hired in the first place?

no proper screening by whoever let him in, and subsequently by the company's hr

[VolksBarSG]

Even when the local PMET is a lazy good for nothing stupid idiot, cannot think, cannot talk properly, cannot write properly, cannot do work? I am sure we have all met these PMETs some time or another and we are left scratching our heads wondering how this idiot ever graduated from university.

 

You know what you will end up with?

 

Something like the Bumiputera policy. When even incompetent fools are guaranteed a job by virtue of their birth.

 

That's why we got KPI. Use that one with a '3 strike' warning system if the PMET is falling below expectations that if they dun buck up after 3 warning a FT will potong jalan their job. Besides, most of our local PMETs are highly competent, hardworking professionals. These aren't young guys looking for a quick buck the easy way. Many local PMETs are mature adults in their late 30s and 40s leh, mind you.