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Carbon82

Mercedes Benz's Engine Downsizing Strategy

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Hypersonic

Mercedes has been coming out with several new variants using smaller (sub 2.0L) engine for its passenger vehicle lineup of late and there seems to be no end to the trend, in view of tighter emissions and fuel economy requirements by EU and other countries.

I have to admit that I am surprised when I learnt about the "new" C160 at the beginning of this year and E180 shortly after that, both having a 1.5L inline 4 turbo-charged unit under it hood, producing 129ps / 210Nm and 156ps / 250Nm respectively. And the naive me thought these are the limits.

batch_IMG-20200109-WA0029.jpg

maxresdefault.jpg

I am wrong, as the CLS260 has just been introduced in China, and spotted the same 1.5L inline 4 unit under the hood, but producing 184ps / 280Nm this time with a help of the mild hybrid setup. Coupled with a 9 speed automatic transmission, it can accelerate to 100 km/h in 8.7 seconds and reach a top speed of 250 km/h. Fuel consumption is rated at 7.2 L/100 km (13.89 Km/L), which is decent to say the least, for a car of this size (~5m in length) and weight (~1.8 ton).

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

While the spec look very impressive for this entry variant, but taking into consideration that the selling price is unlikely to be more than $30K different from the CLS350 due to COE, VES and other vehicle taxes, while saving in road tax is "negligible" since the CLS350 is actually powered by a 2.0L turbo engine (instead of 3.0L as many have expected), it is not a good deal after all.

What is your take? Will we be seeing a 1.5L S280 soon, or even a GLS300? I sincerely hope it will not happen.

BTW, rumor mill is saying that the next C43 AMG and E53 AMG will be using a 2.0L unit... ...

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Supersonic

So sad! Better drive those V8s and Turbo 6 while they are still around. 

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Supersonic
2 hours ago, Carbon82 said:

Mercedes has been coming out with several new variants using smaller (sub 2.0L) engine for its passenger vehicle lineup of late and there seems to be no end to the trend, in view of tighter emissions and fuel economy requirements by EU and other countries.

I have to admit that I am surprised when I learnt about the "new" C160 at the beginning of this year and E180 shortly after that, both having a 1.5L inline 4 turbo-charged unit under it hood, producing 129ps / 210Nm and 156ps / 250Nm respectively. And the naive me thought these are the limits.

batch_IMG-20200109-WA0029.jpg

maxresdefault.jpg

I am wrong, as the CLS260 has just been introduced in China, and spotted the same 1.5L inline 4 unit under the hood, but producing 184ps / 280Nm this time with a help of the mild hybrid setup. Coupled with a 9 speed automatic transmission, it can accelerate to 100 km/h in 8.7 seconds and reach a top speed of 250 km/h. Fuel consumption is rated at 7.2 L/100 km (13.89 Km/L), which is decent to say the least, for a car of this size (~5m in length) and weight (~1.8 ton).

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

 

BTW, rumor mill is saying that the next C43 AMG and E53 AMG will be using a 2.0L unit... ...

I wouldn't worry about that. The A45 (and related variants) which is a "true AMG" (unlike 43/53) has been doing very well on a 2L turbo 4 banger.

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Supersonic
2 hours ago, Volvobrick said:

So sad! Better drive those V8s and Turbo 6 while they are still around. 

Luckily I have one of each, a twin turbo V8 and a (twin scroll) turbo IL6.😁

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Supersonic (edited)

And I wouldn't worry too much about decreasing displacement. 

The A45 is not even close to being the HP/displacement champion for stock cars. 

The Leblanc Caroline GTR still holds the crown for the highest stock HP from a 2L 4 cyl turbo engine to the best of my knowledge (and I could have overlooked some even rarer car). But the Caroline makes a whopping 512hp, and because of its miniscule weight, it was able to do 0 to 60 in 2.7s. And it's not exactly a new model. Tech has only gotten better since.

Edited by Turboflat4

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Turbocharged (edited)

No 4 Cyls Sound can replace V6,V8 or In Line 6 Sound....but 4 Cyls still better than 3 Cyls.

Edited by ER-3682
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5th Gear

If I am not mistaken, China has a 2.0T engine for the S-Class.

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3rd Gear
1 hour ago, ER-3682 said:

No 4 Cyls Sound can replace V6,V8 or In Line 6 Sound....but 4 Cyls still better than 3 Cyls.

Agreed on above comment even turbo added to it. My reason turbo is just an add-on and will not always be ON throughout the journey. a bigger cc NA is always n more stable compared to a smaller cc with turbo added to it. 

 

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Turbocharged
8 hours ago, Carbon82 said:

Mercedes has been coming out with several new variants using smaller (sub 2.0L) engine for its passenger vehicle lineup of late and there seems to be no end to the trend, in view of tighter emissions and fuel economy requirements by EU and other countries.

I have to admit that I am surprised when I learnt about the "new" C160 at the beginning of this year and E180 shortly after that, both having a 1.5L inline 4 turbo-charged unit under it hood, producing 129ps / 210Nm and 156ps / 250Nm respectively. And the naive me thought these are the limits.

batch_IMG-20200109-WA0029.jpg

maxresdefault.jpg

I am wrong, as the CLS260 has just been introduced in China, and spotted the same 1.5L inline 4 unit under the hood, but producing 184ps / 280Nm this time with a help of the mild hybrid setup. Coupled with a 9 speed automatic transmission, it can accelerate to 100 km/h in 8.7 seconds and reach a top speed of 250 km/h. Fuel consumption is rated at 7.2 L/100 km (13.89 Km/L), which is decent to say the least, for a car of this size (~5m in length) and weight (~1.8 ton).

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

While the spec look very impressive for this entry variant, but taking into consideration that the selling price is unlikely to be more than $30K different from the CLS350 due to COE, VES and other vehicle taxes, while saving in road tax is "negligible" since the CLS350 is actually powered by a 2.0L turbo engine (instead of 3.0L as many have expected), it is not a good deal after all.

What is your take? Will we be seeing a 1.5L S280 soon, or even a GLS300? I sincerely hope it will not happen.

BTW, rumor mill is saying that the next C43 AMG and E53 AMG will be using a 2.0L unit... ...

I think no choice for the manufacturer. The emission test in Europe is very stringent. Even if they have mastered the v8 and v12, they cannot produce for the masses. 😔

Anyway, not like I can afford a v8 car anyway. 🤷‍♂️

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Supersonic
7 minutes ago, kobayashiGT said:

I think no choice for the manufacturer. The emission test in Europe is very stringent. Even if they have mastered the v8 and v12, they cannot produce for the masses. 😔

Anyway, not like I can afford a v8 car anyway. 🤷‍♂️

It is a overall Group emission

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Supersonic
6 hours ago, Turboflat4 said:

I wouldn't worry about that. The A45 (and related variants) which is a "true AMG" (unlike 43/53) has been doing very well on a 2L turbo 4 banger.

😂

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Supersonic

The problem with Merc is it lack hybrid cars in its current lineup.  On the other hand, it wants to go straight to EV.  Look like this downsizing suits Singapore with cheaper C and E class.

MERCEDES wan sui

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Turbocharged (edited)
4 hours ago, ER-3682 said:

No 4 Cyls Sound can replace V6,V8 or In Line 6 Sound....but 4 Cyls still better than 3 Cyls.

this should suffice. But if the idea is to go fast and nothing else matters, like NHV, the 3 cylinder engine does well.

Just that cost wise, its sort of defeats the purpose.

If u referring to Mitsubishi attrage .. its a different story.

Edited by Sdf4786k
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Turbocharged
13 minutes ago, Sdf4786k said:

this should suffice. But if the idea is to go fast and nothing else matters, like NHV, the 3 cylinder engine does well.

Just that cost wise, its sort of defeats the purpose.

If u referring to Mitsubishi attrage .. its a different story.

I hope to own a Honda S660 Manual Before the EOL. Haha. At least I can really tell ppl I have driven a Rear engine rear wheel drive car before. hahhaa. 3 cyclinder or not, not very impt. hahah.

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Supersonic
2 hours ago, inlinesix said:

The problem with Merc is it lack hybrid cars in its current lineup.  On the other hand, it wants to go straight to EV.  Look like this downsizing suits Singapore with cheaper C and E class.

MERCEDES wan sui

This EV is pretty amazing. 

 

slsforweb4_0_1.jpg

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Turbocharged
3 hours ago, inlinesix said:

It is a overall Group emission

Yah but one v8 output 200g/km Or more of co2 will throw their whole average off. 

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3rd Gear
13 hours ago, Carbon82 said:

Mercedes has been coming out with several new variants using smaller (sub 2.0L) engine for its passenger vehicle lineup of late and there seems to be no end to the trend, in view of tighter emissions and fuel economy requirements by EU and other countries.

I have to admit that I am surprised when I learnt about the "new" C160 at the beginning of this year and E180 shortly after that, both having a 1.5L inline 4 turbo-charged unit under it hood, producing 129ps / 210Nm and 156ps / 250Nm respectively. And the naive me thought these are the limits.

batch_IMG-20200109-WA0029.jpg

maxresdefault.jpg

I am wrong, as the CLS260 has just been introduced in China, and spotted the same 1.5L inline 4 unit under the hood, but producing 184ps / 280Nm this time with a help of the mild hybrid setup. Coupled with a 9 speed automatic transmission, it can accelerate to 100 km/h in 8.7 seconds and reach a top speed of 250 km/h. Fuel consumption is rated at 7.2 L/100 km (13.89 Km/L), which is decent to say the least, for a car of this size (~5m in length) and weight (~1.8 ton).

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

2020-mercedes-cls-260.jpg

While the spec look very impressive for this entry variant, but taking into consideration that the selling price is unlikely to be more than $30K different from the CLS350 due to COE, VES and other vehicle taxes, while saving in road tax is "negligible" since the CLS350 is actually powered by a 2.0L turbo engine (instead of 3.0L as many have expected), it is not a good deal after all.

What is your take? Will we be seeing a 1.5L S280 soon, or even a GLS300? I sincerely hope it will not happen.

BTW, rumor mill is saying that the next C43 AMG and E53 AMG will be using a 2.0L unit... ...

W206 C63S - using A45S engine with electric battery 

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3rd Gear

My take - C&C will sell you whatever they can, as long there is demand 

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